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10-17-19 10:42 PM

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Controversy gone too far?
Why do people overreact?
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Controversy gone too far?

 

11-10-16 02:12 PM
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I was at work today, saw a TV playing News, and what was on? People protesting Trump. Maybe I'm in the minority, but we haven't seen anything yet, since he's barely even had enough time to say anything other than an acceptance speech. We don't know what he'll really do. Politicians make claims ALL the time. That doesn't mean that their actually going to do what they said. 

Obama made promises, Bush made promises, and Clinton made promises... You get the point. Everyone tries to make themselves sound good before election. This makes people want to vote for them, this increases the amount of votes he'll get. This has nothing to do with his actually capability as President. 

Protesting won't change anything, do you really think they'll put him in as President, and then be like, "Just kidding, we are going to make Hillary Clinton President.) Not going to happen. What's done is done. Get over it. (Not trying to be hostile towards those who don't like the results... I'm not 100% happy on this either, but I would be less happy with Hillary. 

I'm Military... I need to be confident that there's someone who won't make unwise decisions with the Military. This is the thing that concerns me the most. A leader who can't use the military, will end up killing thousands of soldiers, and this makes it difficult. As much as I don't like Trump, I feel more confident in his aptitude than Hillary... (That's more of a Gut feeling for me. But we know Hillary wasn't thinking right with Benghazi, which to be fair was a CIA operation, not military.) 

My point for all of this, STOP hating before he did anything. People fear the unknown. I get it, but change is part of life. Adapt. It's something that we'll have to learn. Get back to your jobs, and start looking for the future. There's many things that are going to happen. The world changes, and people make mistakes, give them another chance. DON'T HATE SOMETHING NEW. Give it a chance, give Trump time to adapt, and learn his limits.Maybe he'll issue in the next era of Economic Prosperity... You never know.
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11-10-16 03:33 PM
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So you're saying that we should just accept Trump as president even though he got less votes than Hillary? We're supposed to accept a sexist, racist, homophobic demagogue as our president over someone who did little wrong? We're supposed to just live with our broken election system? Are we not supposed to invoke our right to free speech or stick to our own values?
If everyone lives their normal life they won't get what they want. If people during the 50's and 60's didn't speak up America may still have segregation today. Protests are essential if we want to make sure something like this doesn't happen again.

"DON'T HATE SOMETHING NEW"
Trump wants to do nothing new besides build a wall. Hating on new things is what the republican party does best. Also accepting someone as president simply because you want to "give it a chance" is a foolish reasoning.
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11-10-16 03:39 PM
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First I'm going to say this. All of my friends who didn't want Trump at all have begin to come to terms with this. They say they watched his celebration speech and said it was a complete 180 from his normal speeches and that he actually looked good and that if he looked like that more and presented like that, things could be okay and that they will let things play through.

As for hating things he never did yet, that's like Ender's Game, "Stop the war and all future wars before they happen" Thats what people want, they want Trump not to do anything at all instead of doing something wrong, but people don't understand that if he does go on to do something wrong, THAT'S when people can start complaining.
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11-10-16 06:18 PM
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earthwarrior : It's funny you would mention free speech as a voice in favour of it Earthy. By telling a fellow person his reasoning is foolish, you are oppressing him. You are nullifying the importance of his balanced logic on the issue and lending an undue importance to your own jaundiced spout of trite anti-president-elect rhetoric. We have heard so much of that in the months leading up and more of it in the last couple days. You believe in free speech but only if your own caterwaul can be heard heads above all others. It's attitudes like yours that keep oppression alive and well.

It's getting boring to see in print and hear people say he will do things that no world leader would ever do in this day and age. Do these people ever listen to themselves at any time?


Did you even bother to research whether he actually said anything that any news medium says he's in favour of? Usually, most of the news reports we get tell us brief facts or just ideas designed to upset us, provoke that emotional reaction, get you hooked on a news provider and make them your go to, thus increasing their market share[their agenda all along]. They are for profit. They are not above sensationalizing the news they report. They focus on upsetting things or just ideas that may not be facts on purpose just to provoke you.

Historically[you are younger than me so you may not realize this yet] the vast majority of currently reported news turns out to be untrue somewhere down the road. That goes double for political reports when a news medium is trying to use its public mass mind control to get loads of people nationwide to adopt their[maybe untrue] rhetoric as you have and get their own political agenda and powerful influence over so many people to pay dividends and make their own power to influence people[in the way they report their news] felt as a hefty tremor on Capitol Hill.

Sometimes political authority kowtows to the press because of this awful mind control power to make people think such things and affect their personal careers. Don Trump is different because he has not been in the game very long. He decided his strategy would be to incite them, giving unrestrained sound-bites that they may think important enough to put in their feeds and not hold back in attacking rivals.


It is not really important who got more millions of singular votes. It is important for the safety and agreement of all American communities that majorities of separate extended communities, that most of those extended communities agreed as a majority to vote in the new President of the United States of America. Surprise, surprise. Democracy sort of works and allows us to be safe at the same time because the ballots we cast locally are anonymous.

When a community comes under threat by a widespread protest that may turn violent at any moment, maybe they were not one such community that agreed as a majority to elect him. They could also have gone the other way on it and were perhaps shy about it; then they let the protestors have their day because the entire rest of the community was unwilling to meet violence with violence and come down as a whole and crush the protestors as one.

In this thread, established 2016 by founder and mayor darthyoda, you are the protestor telling him his vote ought not to count. You are oppressing him and making it known he cannot say his piece without being rudely smacked down for it.


When you have time in your busy schedule, please see if you can locate the news rhetoric cable feed that leads directly into your head and unplug it if you have that ability.

Then when you are unplugged[Matrix reference] if you ever are and really give yourself an opportunity to think clearly about what you have done here, please consider issuing darthyoda a genuine apology.


People are not so black and white as you may think. The Republican party is not all bad. Republican Abraham Lincoln worked to free slaves of all races[not just black] because it was unfair and amoral at a time when the Democ[rat] movement opposed everything to do with morality and fairness. Say this for the Repubs, they know their morals and they hold fast to what they know no matter what it costs.

You may not like or accept this about Don Trump but he has entirely his own high level of morality which remains unchanged over the years. He lived through the free-love and wife-swapping movements while committing to his past wives and eventually losing them because they[women] were stupid enough to buy into that foul nonsense[as though it were normal or how things ought to be - they were just horny and didn't share his morals].

Yes. He believes there was more morality before he was a man. As a boy, watched his parents. Saw they were kind and decent and now wants to bring their kind influence back into the world as leader.

For sure he would not reintroduce segregation. Do not even suggest such a thing. No world leader would repeal laws that are for the good of their people.


darthyoda: CIA is so military. Collection of data on enemies is a central effort to success in all wartime operations. The fact that they continue operations even in relative peace times telegraphs how serious they must be. An infantry soldier gets to go home if he is smart enough, lucky enough and able enough to do his bit and survive, then decline signing up for the next tour of duty if it just happens to be one that results in his death. Spies take their work home with them.

Most of their field operatives are formerly affiliated and trained with other military factions, so to say they are absolutely not military does them no compliment. Their operations are sometimes very covert and must at certain times employ lethal force to complete objectives. Ideally, no one gets killed but they are military, so what do you think is going to happen?



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There are better ways for change then burning a Trump doll in the middle of downtown and showing up to Trump tower with pitch forks and torches.

Donald WILL go along to get along in Washington. His victory speech like Zanderlex mentioned is a 180 from what he was ranting on about during his campaign and that should scare his supporters more than his haters. The whole talk about mass deportations and building a wall was just a tactic used to get attention from voters I highly doubt congress or those within his party would approve of either idea. People are forgetting Washington isn't run by just one single person it's a team effort. He will need to get along with others there or nothing will get accomplished and he could very well risk impeachment from within the establishment if he thinks he is a god and can do as he pleases.

Trump is the least of our worries right now. He is a newbie and will be taking advice from those with experience before he makes any drastic decision making or at least that is what I think will happen. The establishment and pissed off voters will also keep him at bay. And to be honest there are probably far worse people in Washington who are not under a media microscope doing very bad things to our country.
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11-10-16 07:54 PM
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Postman3 : How is informing someone that their reasoning is foolish oppressive?
When I said protests are necessary I meant they are necessary for the election system to change and so someone like Trump wouldn't be able to get the republican nominee or become president.
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11-10-16 10:09 PM
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Postman3 : First off... CIA is not military, the military has their own intelligence assets. Military Intelligence, is much older than the CIA. They are a "spy" agency. They collect data to find moles and other things like that, they don't focus their attention on warfare. (While is the difference between Military and their Intelligence.)

All I wanted to say with this thread is that we should give him a fighting chance. He won't do anything till next year. We know nothing of what he'll be like as President, let him get into office, if you don't like the results, or system, send a letter to congress. I don't like the system, the electoral college makes no sense. But, there's nothing I can do to change it, and protesting isn't going to help. Most likely, protesting will most likely hurt your cause more than help. There are many things you can do that don't include taking to the streets. 

earthwarrior : Hillary didn't even get close... She got 228 votes while Trump 290. He won, fair and square... also, it shouldn't be surprising, since no publicity is bad publicity. Being that controversial gives him a lot of publicity... Thus his name was thrown around, left and right. The electoral college doesn't really represent the majority... Since they don't have to vote for the person the people voted for. It's kind of stupid, since your vote only gives them a "hint" on who they should vote for. 

Postman, as much as the media has an influence, I personally don't like any of them more than others... Since it's really just propaganda. If there's nothing to report, they'll make something. I was just walking past a TV which was reporting protesting... It's annoying me, since people take to the streets to change something that won't change... It doesn't make sense to protest. 

While I do appreciate constructive criticism, I don't particular enjoy people calling others ignorant, which I can draw from your context, to both earthwarrior and myself... While I get your point, about the media's control, it doesn't help your cause. 
  
JigSaw : Exactly! That's the point I wanted to get across! But, I do have to agree that his acceptance speech should/ could be a concern for both his supporters and others. Thank you for your input!
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Why do people overreact? Because it is human nature to. Of course,most of the protesters were idiotic college kids,illegals,and the ones that fear that public assistance will end. But Darth is correct,Trump has not taken office yet,he has not had a chance to do anything. Give the guy at least to his first 100 days whether you hate him or not.
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11-10-16 11:27 PM
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I'm not really surprised, but I hope things calm down before this escalates into violence.

But in all honesty, the angry protests that are going on right now aren't really that far of a stretch from the emotions that were coming from both sides pre-election. If Clinton had won, do you think the other side would be quiet, or would they be protesting as well? This has building for awhile, and within the past several months has really become like a snowball rolling down a hill. Hatred is toxic - and there was a lot of it in this last election. The fact that one side is just as riled up now as they were before the election is not much of a shock.

However, it is a concern. I'm not a supporter of Trump, but I really hope he finds a way to connect with the rest of the country.
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darthyoda : I had yo back yo punk butt mutha- not going to do Lenny Kravitz right now. Know why? Because he dies mid-way through Catching Fire. That sets a bad tone.

I made no suggestion that you were ill-informed darthy. I just find your perspective a little jaundiced. CIA may be a newer military institution but that does not make them less significant than your hallowed military institution. Who has people on the ground their entire careers in foreign countries with no leave all for the purpose of giving other military personnel by covertly sent messages the scoop on just about any subtle or dangerous circumstance they may not be aware of? The CIA. Warfare is the main focus of why data collection agencies even exist. War made them necessary. They serve no other purpose.

There is definitely no denying that your personnel and their personnel are one and the same. If you signed up for specialized training and did amazing in the field, you might attract the attention of covert intelligence recruitment officers, maybe even long before your eventual honourable discharge when you choose to hang it up. They might want you to jump ship and work for another militarized institution known as "the state department". We all know what that means now.

Whatever military forces you are a part of is deep in bed with the CIA and as much as you try to downplay it, I do believe you know that quite as well as any one person can know such a thing. Other personnel may know more depending on needing to know. I think darthy being quite intelligent knows much more than he lets on. I respect that. No need to loosen the lips because that is how ships get sunk. Say no more.


By the way, do you guys know what the sum result of protesting is in most countries including the US and Canada is? In positive result terms at least, it could be represented as the brief word "zip". Yes. No matter how favourably the press reviews the action of desperation, the numerical positive value is always the same old zero. I'm sure you knew that darthy so you're right. "It doesn't make sense to protest."

People hurt other people and whether they do that or not, they already succeed in sending their own minds into disorganized turmoil. Many thread creators in this forum were in such a desperate protesting mood. The angry threads that popped up the day after the election didn't begin at all as balanced in logic as yours did darthy. They were so scary angry that logic was completely inaccessible to them. Yoda himself would have sighed and gently suggested more patience. "Required it is to let rational thoughts inhabit once again a calm mind."

I do not really have a cause darthy. I'm not really embroiled in the thick of this the way some people[hem,hem, few spaces above] clearly are. It causes me no discomfort to welcome a new world leader with as much controversy to offer as any politician who actually possesses any real venality.

It's just a little odd. Most of the angry guys are say, 16 year old boys who haven't seen the things I have seen because they were not alive in the nineties. They do not bother to take into account what times, struggles and knowledge preceded their existence. They have no idea who the Clintons have been, where they've been three decades leading to their own untold importance as teenage citizens today.

Buckets of blind support are thrown to the Clintons because we have no idea whose bed their boots have been under. Bill is a heart burglar and his wife supports that adultery by taking no stand against it. When he publicly apologized for his perfidy, he stressed that his personal life was nobody's business. He didn't care that he was setting up an example for his
entire nation in the way they live their lives. He never cared, neither did she. A woman setting good example would not stand so long in such a disrespectful cesspool.

It's easy now for a would-be adulterer to point at the Clinton example and say that it may be just fine for them because it is fine for the much higher ups to do. There was unbelieving amazement when Kennedy was caught for one of his many affairs. Very seldom did people actually think that way.

Maybe that's the pure moral attitude Don Trump thinks is right that existed in the fifties but did not last until the end of the sixties due to Kennedy's example. He was insanely popular. He experienced very little backlash. People just could not believe it. "Free-love" was the word preached by horny would-be promiscuous lovers in the wake his death because he was given martyr status despite dying for no cause other than being a psychotic man's obsession.

In the nineties, a presidential affair pops up and piles of people now know from experience it is not so awesome as Kennedy made it out to be. So many wives were mad that they were cheated on and they were personally not impressed with how Mrs. Clinton handled it. Bad example for everyone with similar experiences which have been identified as more and more common. Of course, most of the commonality is still fiction caused by the familiarity of the film medium.

Still, several times more affairs happen in the ongoing current day than they did in the Eisenhower and Truman era. Men and some women still fall for the illusion that it is all fine and dandy.


earthwarrior : Earthy. Poor Earthy. On shaky ground and you have no idea. That's why you haven't been my priority address all this time.

Protests, my poor misled friend, are never necessary as they accomplish nothing. The only influence they have is to frighten people. That is not positive. It is not productive. That's the case darthy is kind of making here. His reasoning makes sense. Did I forget to say that?

Why would you try to shut him down for no reason at all?

All the "reasons" you did give were the same illogical structure as had been repeated by hundreds of sources, each hundred of them coming from any direction you were to look to find out what could be really happening. Yes, those exact same point specific arguments are everywhere, have been for months and just how do they actually mean anything when you just spout them off as a repetitive rhetoric?


How did you never wonder that the election you aren't yet eligible to vote in, may not be hinged on these issues that the news media puffs up to be more important to functioning adults than they really are? The scorned woman example is a good reason many women do not vote for any Clinton ever again. Real women have morals, emotions and beliefs to back them up. Trump shrewdly purports to have pre-Kennedy fidelity beliefs.


Are you getting it? Can we not oppress others' opinions with derogatory remarks?

I would never suggest that you are foolish because I respect and like you. I merely suggest that you haven't been around long enough to have seen what I have - noting the significance when it is currently happening or later on when history has made the story much clearer than the shocking current day newsreel has. One day, you may look back upon this election and say, "Yeah. What was I thinking? This WikiLeaks document is totally giving me so much more satisfying details of what went on behind the stage curtain while I was busy getting angry and insulting people without cause when I had no business doing so."


Earthy. No matter what outside influences try to trigger you, do not let it change how you behave towards people. The person you are is important to real people in the world. You are currently a very good person. Only you can take that from you now.


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darthyoda : Hillary got 60,274,974 popular votes while Trump got 59,937,338 votes. In most other countries Hillary would've won.
The electors don't go against their state's popular vote. It doesn't happen. Also writing a letter to a republican controlled congress won't get anything changed.

Postman3 : You're overreacting to what I said to darth.
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earthwarrior : But, as I said, popular vote doesn't really affect the electoral college... It goes based on a "winner takes all." Each person in there votes, and when the majority in the electoral college vote for someone, all of them count for him. This makes no sense to me either, but it was something put in place by the founding fathers... 

At this point, I don't believe that'll change.
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 earthwarrior:  There you go again. Belittling what people say because they are not you. This time I am the target.  It is not just you or your comments that I was referring to. Every sixteen year old boy making a thread on the subject this week is enraged the point of temporarily losing logical function.

 Does it make sense for any of them to rage about how they hate this and that?  Think about the example you also set for your peers. You may have more influence than you think you do. Don't you want to lead by showing a polite, courteous and noble example?

 I would not say to discipline yourself too harshly about the matter. We[with not yet corrupted potential] all do what we can to gradually improve.  I once had just about the same or even worse a callous attitude as you have displayed when I was sixteen and like you, I was not a bad person either.

 Ahem. Yes. I'm sure I overreacted in this thread by being too rational and reasoning out each significant issue. I will make it clear if it was not already that I haven't lost my cool once here. No anger motivates my discussions. Why would it? I have no vested interest in the political agenda.

 As I have found earlier explanations for, the total vote means zip. What matters is that more zip codes came together as majorities to support Don Trump by a landslide. It matters little that people of 228 amalgamated voting areas are a tad more populous than the other 290 collectively. The safety, security and agreement of more communities is more important than any collective individuals interspersed sporadically throughout those communities.

 By referencing the "by the millions" statistics, any individuals giving them credence simply reveal themselves to have no knowledge of these very important stability and safety concerns. That is not to say they are generally an ignorant person; they simply paid no attention to what is really important. The frightening post-election riot reaction is more pivotal to this reasoning than any everyday American may realize. We do not need whole communities overthrown by violent people not wanting to accept the new president. I have closely dear extended relatives of American citizenship living there. I am pleased they will not be put in peril because this voting system prevents an unmanageable state of widespread unrest.

 Some American citizens who are not eligible to vote yet are only concerned with themselves. It is because of this immaturity that they may not vote. Given time, a young human will begin to care more about others than themselves. Willingness to discuss the short list of small, petty issues the reporting media posits to us is good because it shows intellect.

 Let us use that fine intellect to ponder who we are really serving here in our thoughts.


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earthwarrior :

You can go ahead and be angry at the voting system and Trump in general. It's an opinion, and I'm fine with that. I'm not fine with it when there are literally violent riots going on just because people didn't get their way. That's like saying I get offended and flame every Vizzed user for having a different opinion.
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11-19-16 05:56 PM
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Lexatom : I said protests, I didn't  mean violent riots. A message can be sent without violence.
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11-19-16 06:08 PM
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earthwarrior :

I misunderstood your post. I thought when you said protests you also meant riots. My apologies.
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11-19-16 08:54 PM
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People over react because they can. Democrats are just mad that Trump beat them at their own game. The protesters are just out to show their displeasure (which is fine,as long as they do not interrupt people's lives,or destroy property,or harm people) or to wreck stuff,harm others,or to steal stuff.

The Democrats need to ask themselves why they lost and how can they reform their party. Part of the reason they lost was that Clinton was an unsavory choice. She may have experience,but that does no good if no one wants to follow you. They lost because the people were fed up with Democrat control and for most of us,it was an abysmal failure.

Trump has not even taken office yet and people already want him to step down,or be assassinated or have Hilary Clinton forcibly forced upon us. Give him a chance like Obama was. Yes,I hate Obama,I hate what he stands for,but I was willing to let him have a chance.

"Why do I hate Obama?" will be the question. I hate that he is an elitist. I hate that he ramrodded things using his executive order on many occasions. I hate that he did nothing to fix things.

In closing,give Trump a chance. If you do not like him,you can vote him out in 4 years.

Thank you for listening,

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11-27-16 02:21 PM
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Maybe if I buy a trump doll and repeatedly bash nails in it, maybe he will drop out of the whitehouse. You've probably seen that method on many TV shows involving people bashing nails into dolls.
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11-27-16 02:47 PM
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Pokemonfan1000 : I HATE to be that guy. But I can't just let this slide. None of what you said had anything to do with anything said in this thread... You're just ranting about your distaste for Trump. This thread is neither Pro nor Anti Trump. It's about giving him a chance. 

Please read ALL of the comments... or at least skim over what was said. This is a discussion thread, not a just comment. Please add to the conversation. 

While I can understand your sentiment, I have to say, It's uncalled for. That is the reason the President has issues going into the white house. (Any President.) When you give someone that much hate before he gets into power, you're being unfair. In a time considered to be the most tolerant, you have to agree that people aren't tolerant to his views. 

Also, I realize you couldn't do anything on this election, as your too young to vote. Wait until the next one. Do what you can. (Even though the electoral college has no dependence on popular vote. But, that is a discussion for a different thread.
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11-27-16 03:01 PM
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darthyoda : I'd just figured since it works on TV shows it would work in real life. The reason people are protesting Trump is because he wasn't the president everyone wanted. I'm about to look up how the popular vote is decided and edit this with more info. I'm all for giving Trump a chance but am afraid he will mess up the country.
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