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A Question to Christians

 

09-17-15 02:56 PM
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I always heard christians say the Bible is evidence of God but yet they call their belief "faith" which is belief without evidence. Can any christian tell me why the belief is still considered faith even though most christians say the bible is proof? It confused me when i was religious and it still confuses me now.
I always heard christians say the Bible is evidence of God but yet they call their belief "faith" which is belief without evidence. Can any christian tell me why the belief is still considered faith even though most christians say the bible is proof? It confused me when i was religious and it still confuses me now.
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09-17-15 04:07 PM
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Faith is not belief without evidence.

Faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. (Hebrews 11:1)

Or in another translation:

Faith is the confidence that what we hope for will actually happen; it gives us assurance about things we cannot see.

There is a substance to faith. "The evidence of things not seen" is in other words believing that God will do what He promises even though there may not be visible evidence of it at the moment.
Faith is not belief without evidence.

Faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. (Hebrews 11:1)

Or in another translation:

Faith is the confidence that what we hope for will actually happen; it gives us assurance about things we cannot see.

There is a substance to faith. "The evidence of things not seen" is in other words believing that God will do what He promises even though there may not be visible evidence of it at the moment.
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Ima try and break it down for you.  Christians have faith, and because of this the bible ,taken on faith, then becomes proof of God.  If you don't have those beliefs then you don't have faith (Or consider the bible proof) and so you question the bible as the "Word of God"..  What I think I'm getting at is that those with faith will consider the Bible as the word of God w/o "physical" proof, while those wi/o this faith will pose your question in a natural way as to gain the faith they seek.
Ima try and break it down for you.  Christians have faith, and because of this the bible ,taken on faith, then becomes proof of God.  If you don't have those beliefs then you don't have faith (Or consider the bible proof) and so you question the bible as the "Word of God"..  What I think I'm getting at is that those with faith will consider the Bible as the word of God w/o "physical" proof, while those wi/o this faith will pose your question in a natural way as to gain the faith they seek.
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TristanTehGamer1 :

Christianity has never rightly called someone to believe without evidence. That is the dumbest definition of faith I've ever heard. I have faith that while I'm typing this, there really are people that will read my post. I have faith that you're not all just artificial intelligence fooling me. And while I've never really examined any evidence because I blindly trust you are all real people, I could create an investigation where I meet with one of yall and confirm you're not an android or what have you. Christian wants to make that claim: it's not that there is no evidence, it is called "faith" because of the trust factor involved. If I tested Solar to see if he was an android, I'd still have to have faith that everyone else wasn't fooling me. I would have to test everyone here. Then I'd have to test my equipment to make sure it wasn't lying. Then I'd have to test my own physical senses to make sure they weren't lying. And ain't nobody got time for that. Christianity should encourage questions and encourage investigation. We've got nothing to hide!
TristanTehGamer1 :

Christianity has never rightly called someone to believe without evidence. That is the dumbest definition of faith I've ever heard. I have faith that while I'm typing this, there really are people that will read my post. I have faith that you're not all just artificial intelligence fooling me. And while I've never really examined any evidence because I blindly trust you are all real people, I could create an investigation where I meet with one of yall and confirm you're not an android or what have you. Christian wants to make that claim: it's not that there is no evidence, it is called "faith" because of the trust factor involved. If I tested Solar to see if he was an android, I'd still have to have faith that everyone else wasn't fooling me. I would have to test everyone here. Then I'd have to test my equipment to make sure it wasn't lying. Then I'd have to test my own physical senses to make sure they weren't lying. And ain't nobody got time for that. Christianity should encourage questions and encourage investigation. We've got nothing to hide!
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09-18-15 08:02 AM
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Thank you all it actually makes sense now
Thank you all it actually makes sense now
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fightorace : So the proof of god is the bible and yet the bible is the only place that god is mentioned?
fightorace : So the proof of god is the bible and yet the bible is the only place that god is mentioned?
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NameEntry :

Also remember that there were Christians before the bible.
NameEntry :

Also remember that there were Christians before the bible.
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Brigand : Nothing in my post has anything about what you posted?
Brigand : Nothing in my post has anything about what you posted?
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If the Bible were absolute proof of Christianity then everyone would be Christian.

It is just a tool that helps bring people to having faith in Christ. The Bible itself says that Peter didn't get his testimony of Jesus from Jesus himself but from the Holy Spirit. Faith in Jesus doesn't come from finding proof of anything but those things can reinforce our faith.
If the Bible were absolute proof of Christianity then everyone would be Christian.

It is just a tool that helps bring people to having faith in Christ. The Bible itself says that Peter didn't get his testimony of Jesus from Jesus himself but from the Holy Spirit. Faith in Jesus doesn't come from finding proof of anything but those things can reinforce our faith.
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If the "bible" were proof of anything, then why do they keep changing it to suit their liking at the time?  Faith is a belief in something.  Belief is not a proof of anything other than a possibility.  The "bible" is in many different languages and called by many different names.  To say that one is right and one is wrong is segregation of our people and that is the reason for hatred and war.  Wake up already
If the "bible" were proof of anything, then why do they keep changing it to suit their liking at the time?  Faith is a belief in something.  Belief is not a proof of anything other than a possibility.  The "bible" is in many different languages and called by many different names.  To say that one is right and one is wrong is segregation of our people and that is the reason for hatred and war.  Wake up already
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12-07-15 08:39 PM
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lordbelial669 : What are you talking about? Bibles that are in different languages are for different people to be able to read the same scriptures. They don't keep changing for their own liking.
lordbelial669 : What are you talking about? Bibles that are in different languages are for different people to be able to read the same scriptures. They don't keep changing for their own liking.
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play4fun : Actually he is half right. Due to any language translation, there is no way that the bible could be "untouched" from one language change to another. Now I am sure that they don't TRY to twist the words of the Book, But there's always differentials in languages that make it so there is no choice.
play4fun : Actually he is half right. Due to any language translation, there is no way that the bible could be "untouched" from one language change to another. Now I am sure that they don't TRY to twist the words of the Book, But there's always differentials in languages that make it so there is no choice.
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Not quite what I meant.  The bible was written from roughly translated scrolls that were found.  You have the old testament, then the new testament, then the king james version, neither of which are the same book.  That's more of what I meant, but yes, I bet many things were lost in translation as well
Not quite what I meant.  The bible was written from roughly translated scrolls that were found.  You have the old testament, then the new testament, then the king james version, neither of which are the same book.  That's more of what I meant, but yes, I bet many things were lost in translation as well
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manicman66 : The key phrase that I'm focusing on is "keep changing it to suit their liking at the time", which is not how scholars deal with Bible translation. Are there people who take out certain parts or books in the Canon to suit their theology? Yes, but that is not how most translations come to existence. Furthermore, those who truly study their Bibles don't just read the words on their translation. Many Bibles have concordances and dictionaries that explains more of the original Greek and Hebrew to bring out more of the meaning of the verse. Just reading the English words in the Bible will not be enough to understand scripture correctly.

lordbelial669 : The King James Version has both the Old Testament and the New Testament in it....in fact, most translations have the Old Testament and the New Testament, other than "Bibles" that intentionally take out books of the canon just to fit their beliefs (This has happened early on). What's amazing about the Bible is that it is translated to different languages for many different people to be able to read, but the methodology is to always start from the original language to translate to the appropriate language, so there is no significant differences between the common translations, but mostly on reading level of the text, word for word vs thought for thought translation style, or advancements in scholarly studies in ancient languages that makes them update the wording in the Bible. A reasonable Christian will not say that one translation is more right than the other to the point of causing hatred and wars, like you said. In fact, that is not even close to being a prominent reason for religious wars in history, due to differences in translations at least.
manicman66 : The key phrase that I'm focusing on is "keep changing it to suit their liking at the time", which is not how scholars deal with Bible translation. Are there people who take out certain parts or books in the Canon to suit their theology? Yes, but that is not how most translations come to existence. Furthermore, those who truly study their Bibles don't just read the words on their translation. Many Bibles have concordances and dictionaries that explains more of the original Greek and Hebrew to bring out more of the meaning of the verse. Just reading the English words in the Bible will not be enough to understand scripture correctly.

lordbelial669 : The King James Version has both the Old Testament and the New Testament in it....in fact, most translations have the Old Testament and the New Testament, other than "Bibles" that intentionally take out books of the canon just to fit their beliefs (This has happened early on). What's amazing about the Bible is that it is translated to different languages for many different people to be able to read, but the methodology is to always start from the original language to translate to the appropriate language, so there is no significant differences between the common translations, but mostly on reading level of the text, word for word vs thought for thought translation style, or advancements in scholarly studies in ancient languages that makes them update the wording in the Bible. A reasonable Christian will not say that one translation is more right than the other to the point of causing hatred and wars, like you said. In fact, that is not even close to being a prominent reason for religious wars in history, due to differences in translations at least.
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NameEntry :

"So the proof of god is the bible and yet the bible is the only place that god is mentioned?"

Our bible actually says God can be known through nature.

Romans 1:19-20, ESV

For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made.
NameEntry :

"So the proof of god is the bible and yet the bible is the only place that god is mentioned?"

Our bible actually says God can be known through nature.

Romans 1:19-20, ESV

For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made.
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(edited by Txgangsta on 12-15-15 04:37 PM)     Post Rating: 1   Liked By: SoL@R,

12-16-15 02:03 PM
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Txgangsta : We all ready have explanations about nature and good ideas about how the world was created so there's no need to believe in a god. This world passed the seventeen hundreds several hundred years ago so there's no need to believe in magic anymore.
Before there was a christian god, people believed that lightning was caused by gods but people stopped believing in that eventually so why do so many people believe in a christian god still?
Txgangsta : We all ready have explanations about nature and good ideas about how the world was created so there's no need to believe in a god. This world passed the seventeen hundreds several hundred years ago so there's no need to believe in magic anymore.
Before there was a christian god, people believed that lightning was caused by gods but people stopped believing in that eventually so why do so many people believe in a christian god still?
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NameEntry :   I can see where this is going, which is not on topic, but let me ask you anyway - Do you believe then nothing made everything?
NameEntry :   I can see where this is going, which is not on topic, but let me ask you anyway - Do you believe then nothing made everything?
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NameEntry :

Unlike Sol@r, I wanna stay on topic.

But actually, you didn't either. You originally said "So the proof of god is the bible and yet the bible is the only place that god is mentioned?" I showed you that our bible even denies the above statement, quite blatantly. Your original comment attempted to show circular reasoning in faith in God, but that no longer holds. Do you concede that your original objection is not valid?
NameEntry :

Unlike Sol@r, I wanna stay on topic.

But actually, you didn't either. You originally said "So the proof of god is the bible and yet the bible is the only place that god is mentioned?" I showed you that our bible even denies the above statement, quite blatantly. Your original comment attempted to show circular reasoning in faith in God, but that no longer holds. Do you concede that your original objection is not valid?
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SoL@R : Let me guess, you're trying the entire "undermine the Big Bang Theory" bit? That's not what the Big Bang Theory states and that's not how it happened. The universe did not "come from nothing." It's highly likely that there were universes before this one and the leftover energy from the universe before this one is what provided the Big Bang.
http://www.space.com/25126-big-bang-theory.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang

There's no evidence of a god and by the same reasoning, I believe in the Invisible Pink Unicorn.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invisible_Pink_Unicorn

Just remember this isn't me mocking you or your religion but me using the same reasoning you use. I want to be able to participate in discussion and not get my trust points lowered any more since somebody decided that I wasn't trustworthy or something.

SoL@R : Let me guess, you're trying the entire "undermine the Big Bang Theory" bit? That's not what the Big Bang Theory states and that's not how it happened. The universe did not "come from nothing." It's highly likely that there were universes before this one and the leftover energy from the universe before this one is what provided the Big Bang.
http://www.space.com/25126-big-bang-theory.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang

There's no evidence of a god and by the same reasoning, I believe in the Invisible Pink Unicorn.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invisible_Pink_Unicorn

Just remember this isn't me mocking you or your religion but me using the same reasoning you use. I want to be able to participate in discussion and not get my trust points lowered any more since somebody decided that I wasn't trustworthy or something.

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Don't forget my post!!! Do you concede?
NameEntry :

Don't forget my post!!! Do you concede?
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