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An Arguement Against Vegans/Vegetarians

 

10-24-12 11:14 PM
TheNameWithNoNumbers is Offline
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(Note: Mods, I am not sure where this thread should go. Since I can't post in Logic/Debate/ASDF, I'm going to post it here.)





Why do people turn Vegan/Vegetarian?

I honestly think it's only one thing. People relate to animals more closely than they do plants.

To be fair, all humans must survive on living things, or something that came from a living thing. No matter how I see it though, in stark, naked logic, is it really fair to favor killing plant life over animal life? See, animals can show pain. They can scream, run, do things that we can relate do. Plants can't scream, or run, unless you are high, or the plants are magic. Plants do show response, but they show it in a quieter, more stationary way. When you damage a plant, it's systems go into high gear to repair itself. And to be fair, eating fruit is kind of like eating veal. Why do we promote that animals should be moved out of cramped conditions, when farmers mass grow crops to feed the local population. Why do we promote not a drop of animal blood should be spared, but then we chop down trees and eat roots. Why?

Because, in stark logic, we just relate more to animals.

We can't stop going, "Aww! Look at the puppy's/piggy's/cow's face! It's so cute!" I've never seen anyone fawn over a plant like that. Animals have more humanlike qualities, and we then feel sympathy towards them. Plants just sit there. Everyone thinks that becoming vegan is "cool, hip", but I've never seen someone eat pure meat out of principal. I'm not insinuating you become a "meatatarian", I'm just saying, that being vegetarian/vegan out of moral principals is (logically) the wrongest thing ever.


And thus, if you cared to read it, that is my long-winded arguement against the V group. (No, not vizzed)


Oh and I just love steak. Like, seriously, who in their mind would give up meat, especially on principle?
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(Note: Mods, I am not sure where this thread should go. Since I can't post in Logic/Debate/ASDF, I'm going to post it here.)





Why do people turn Vegan/Vegetarian?

I honestly think it's only one thing. People relate to animals more closely than they do plants.

To be fair, all humans must survive on living things, or something that came from a living thing. No matter how I see it though, in stark, naked logic, is it really fair to favor killing plant life over animal life? See, animals can show pain. They can scream, run, do things that we can relate do. Plants can't scream, or run, unless you are high, or the plants are magic. Plants do show response, but they show it in a quieter, more stationary way. When you damage a plant, it's systems go into high gear to repair itself. And to be fair, eating fruit is kind of like eating veal. Why do we promote that animals should be moved out of cramped conditions, when farmers mass grow crops to feed the local population. Why do we promote not a drop of animal blood should be spared, but then we chop down trees and eat roots. Why?

Because, in stark logic, we just relate more to animals.

We can't stop going, "Aww! Look at the puppy's/piggy's/cow's face! It's so cute!" I've never seen anyone fawn over a plant like that. Animals have more humanlike qualities, and we then feel sympathy towards them. Plants just sit there. Everyone thinks that becoming vegan is "cool, hip", but I've never seen someone eat pure meat out of principal. I'm not insinuating you become a "meatatarian", I'm just saying, that being vegetarian/vegan out of moral principals is (logically) the wrongest thing ever.


And thus, if you cared to read it, that is my long-winded arguement against the V group. (No, not vizzed)


Oh and I just love steak. Like, seriously, who in their mind would give up meat, especially on principle?
Crazy bro.
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10-24-12 11:17 PM
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I think the vegans/vegetarians feel like the animals have maybe "equal rights" when it comes down to it. They might feel that killing animals is just as bad as killing an animal. This is all pure speculation, so I don't really know why.
I think the vegans/vegetarians feel like the animals have maybe "equal rights" when it comes down to it. They might feel that killing animals is just as bad as killing an animal. This is all pure speculation, so I don't really know why.
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10-25-12 12:03 AM
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Just as it comes to people's religious (or lack of) beliefs, I do not care what eating lifestyles people choose, as long as they do not criticize or try to convert my own.

I do know some people just can not handle eating meat because their head psyches them out, or some sort of other phobia. A friend of mine is a vegetarian not by choice, but stricken by his choking phobia; he once choked on some meat way back when, and apparently it traumatized him so much that he just CANNOT eat meat and various other food (popcorn too). I think there was more to it, but that is all he told me.


Another friend of mine found a vegan dietary plan that helped with muscle gaining. I can not say I understood it, but... he got results! Of course, one can do that with meat just as well, probably easier and less money costs too.
Just as it comes to people's religious (or lack of) beliefs, I do not care what eating lifestyles people choose, as long as they do not criticize or try to convert my own.

I do know some people just can not handle eating meat because their head psyches them out, or some sort of other phobia. A friend of mine is a vegetarian not by choice, but stricken by his choking phobia; he once choked on some meat way back when, and apparently it traumatized him so much that he just CANNOT eat meat and various other food (popcorn too). I think there was more to it, but that is all he told me.


Another friend of mine found a vegan dietary plan that helped with muscle gaining. I can not say I understood it, but... he got results! Of course, one can do that with meat just as well, probably easier and less money costs too.
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10-25-12 01:26 AM
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Homosapiens are omnivores... we are built to eat both meat and plants. It's just what's natural. Meat contains protein which is essential to us as humans. Vegetarians have to struggle to find ways to supplement their diets with protein just so they don't die. That right there tells me that something is wrong.

And if people do it because they don't want to hurt animals... well, scientists have found evidence that suggests plants can feel pain. So do you want to stop eating plants now too to spare them the pain? Now you just starve to death.
Homosapiens are omnivores... we are built to eat both meat and plants. It's just what's natural. Meat contains protein which is essential to us as humans. Vegetarians have to struggle to find ways to supplement their diets with protein just so they don't die. That right there tells me that something is wrong.

And if people do it because they don't want to hurt animals... well, scientists have found evidence that suggests plants can feel pain. So do you want to stop eating plants now too to spare them the pain? Now you just starve to death.
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10-25-12 08:38 AM
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I don't like hurting animals or anything like that, but most places kill them humanely, i.e. with as little pain as possible. Also, not only what Crazi Li said about plants feeling pain (I have heard that as well), vegans don't consider that while all their precious grains and vegetables are being harvested, animals die too. And not even to be eaten. Field mice, gophers, etc. die in the process just because they live outdoors near what they want to eat.

It's fine to be a good person and have a conscience, but it could just go around and around and around forever. You can't "win". I figure I'll stop eating animals if they stop being so damn delicious, and I don't foresee that happening anytime in my life. Also animals are great, blah blah blah, but what else should we eat for protein? Humans? Vegetarians and vegans are sketchy.
I don't like hurting animals or anything like that, but most places kill them humanely, i.e. with as little pain as possible. Also, not only what Crazi Li said about plants feeling pain (I have heard that as well), vegans don't consider that while all their precious grains and vegetables are being harvested, animals die too. And not even to be eaten. Field mice, gophers, etc. die in the process just because they live outdoors near what they want to eat.

It's fine to be a good person and have a conscience, but it could just go around and around and around forever. You can't "win". I figure I'll stop eating animals if they stop being so damn delicious, and I don't foresee that happening anytime in my life. Also animals are great, blah blah blah, but what else should we eat for protein? Humans? Vegetarians and vegans are sketchy.
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10-25-12 10:38 AM
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Hmm wonder why you couldn't post in Debate/Logic thread. Seems like an appropiate thread. But I guess I wouldn't know.

My theory on veganism is this...

1. Its their belief- While I respect someone for being a vegan because they are a huge animal rights protester, I must argue that humanity is also an animal (even thou this goes against lets say God creating man with an independent mind and rational seperate from the beast who does something without think about it). Humanity and Animals are similar in that we eat to survive, fight to survive, run to survive, and sometimes kill to survive (the last one is more common in animals since humanity looks down on murder). The only major difference between man and animals is that human feels peity after doing something that is considered "evil", animals don't (well maybe some animals do show peity, but a vast majority don't; and also some humans don't feel peity for murder, rape, or any other similar crimes). I guess I should also point out that while animals eat their own kind (sharks for example), humanity can also eat each other (Donor Party for example and despite the fact that canibalism is something that society looks HUGELY DOWN upon).

2. Like KG and Crazy Li said, plants can feel pain and might have feelings also. If that is the case then should a vegan also not eat plants since they too can feel pain or have feelings. I ask any Vegan or Vegitarian to think about this question cause if you say that yes we shouldn't eat plants since they too can feel pain or emotions then how are we going to eat? If you say no, then where do we draw the line on if something feels pain or has emotions then is it okay to eat it?

I will repeat I don't have anything against vegans as I've went to school with some vegans and some of my family and friends are vegitarians/vegans, its just I don't think their beliefs on why we should be a vegan is not a strong enough reason.


Hmm wonder why you couldn't post in Debate/Logic thread. Seems like an appropiate thread. But I guess I wouldn't know.

My theory on veganism is this...

1. Its their belief- While I respect someone for being a vegan because they are a huge animal rights protester, I must argue that humanity is also an animal (even thou this goes against lets say God creating man with an independent mind and rational seperate from the beast who does something without think about it). Humanity and Animals are similar in that we eat to survive, fight to survive, run to survive, and sometimes kill to survive (the last one is more common in animals since humanity looks down on murder). The only major difference between man and animals is that human feels peity after doing something that is considered "evil", animals don't (well maybe some animals do show peity, but a vast majority don't; and also some humans don't feel peity for murder, rape, or any other similar crimes). I guess I should also point out that while animals eat their own kind (sharks for example), humanity can also eat each other (Donor Party for example and despite the fact that canibalism is something that society looks HUGELY DOWN upon).

2. Like KG and Crazy Li said, plants can feel pain and might have feelings also. If that is the case then should a vegan also not eat plants since they too can feel pain or have feelings. I ask any Vegan or Vegitarian to think about this question cause if you say that yes we shouldn't eat plants since they too can feel pain or emotions then how are we going to eat? If you say no, then where do we draw the line on if something feels pain or has emotions then is it okay to eat it?

I will repeat I don't have anything against vegans as I've went to school with some vegans and some of my family and friends are vegitarians/vegans, its just I don't think their beliefs on why we should be a vegan is not a strong enough reason.

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(edited by Oldschool41 on 10-25-12 10:39 AM)    

10-25-12 01:04 PM
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KG : You make a very good point about the animals that die and not for any actual gain. I don't believe in slaughtering wildlife without a purpose... and I believe that animals should only be killed out of necessity... like to provide food. I don't endorse things like hunting unless you eat your kill.

I like to believe that farms typically treat the animals well before they kill them. I know this isn't always going to be true... but they're not all inhumane either.

The one meat I can think of that I absolutely will NOT tolerate is veal, though. It's impossible to produce veal in a humane way. It's really the most sick process I've ever heard of, basically torturing young calves to produce meat of a certain texture that quite frankly isn't even all that great if you ask me.
KG : You make a very good point about the animals that die and not for any actual gain. I don't believe in slaughtering wildlife without a purpose... and I believe that animals should only be killed out of necessity... like to provide food. I don't endorse things like hunting unless you eat your kill.

I like to believe that farms typically treat the animals well before they kill them. I know this isn't always going to be true... but they're not all inhumane either.

The one meat I can think of that I absolutely will NOT tolerate is veal, though. It's impossible to produce veal in a humane way. It's really the most sick process I've ever heard of, basically torturing young calves to produce meat of a certain texture that quite frankly isn't even all that great if you ask me.
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It's maybe because they can't eat meat because they care about the animals and don't want to eat them. Since plants grow, the Vegetarians only wants to eat plants and fruit. And, no I am not a/an Vegetarians.








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It's maybe because they can't eat meat because they care about the animals and don't want to eat them. Since plants grow, the Vegetarians only wants to eat plants and fruit. And, no I am not a/an Vegetarians.








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Black Bot : Still, it makes no sense. Plants are living things and feel pain. And animals grow too.


Oh, and I also have no bias against vegans/vegetarians. I just think their logic is is fallible, so yeah.


Relating to the phobia, that makes sense. He doesn't do it on principal, he just does it because he has a phobia.

Oh and I agree with you, KG. Them animals are just too goshdarn tasty.
Black Bot : Still, it makes no sense. Plants are living things and feel pain. And animals grow too.


Oh, and I also have no bias against vegans/vegetarians. I just think their logic is is fallible, so yeah.


Relating to the phobia, that makes sense. He doesn't do it on principal, he just does it because he has a phobia.

Oh and I agree with you, KG. Them animals are just too goshdarn tasty.
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