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Can we all be right about God?
05-12-11 02:55 PM
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Could every person's individual beliefs about God be right? Those who are Christian die and they get their Heaven. Muslims die and get their Heaven. Buddhists die and are reincarnated. Atheists die and simply disappear. The old Nordic guys are all chilling in Valhalla, etc.
Can this happen? Can this happen? |
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05-12-11 06:41 PM
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Well, I suppose this can be taken as a personal opinion to some, but I encourage that you not rule it out as that. I think that, in some cases, religions are cultural; and in some cases, to be of another religion is to go against your culture. Well, everyone is free to think what they want happens when we die. Fact is though, whether people believe in it or not, that Jesus was the only "Prophet" to conquer death.
He was dead and arose from the dead after three days and now sits at the right hand of God. All other prophets are either still in their graves, or cannot authoritatively offer a way to heaven as Jesus does. He says in the Bible, "I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live." This is because he has power over death. The evidence supporting his resurrection is overwhelming, first, there were over five hundred eye witnesses of him after his resurrection. Also, history has it that most of his early followers sacrificed their lives and became martyrs, I highly doubt anyone would do this for a fraud. I've posted on this subject a while back that expounds on what I'm saying here - https://www.vizzed.com/vizzedboard/thread.php?id=13923&ppp=20&page=1#216155 He was dead and arose from the dead after three days and now sits at the right hand of God. All other prophets are either still in their graves, or cannot authoritatively offer a way to heaven as Jesus does. He says in the Bible, "I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live." This is because he has power over death. The evidence supporting his resurrection is overwhelming, first, there were over five hundred eye witnesses of him after his resurrection. Also, history has it that most of his early followers sacrificed their lives and became martyrs, I highly doubt anyone would do this for a fraud. I've posted on this subject a while back that expounds on what I'm saying here - https://www.vizzed.com/vizzedboard/thread.php?id=13923&ppp=20&page=1#216155 |
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05-13-11 01:39 AM
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This is taking a relativistic/post-modernistic point of view. This, however, is not correct. Even in a logical sense, this is considered fallacious.
I'll go along with this scenario and pretend that I don't believe that Christianity is correct and considering other stances. If you look at all of these stances (Muslims need to follow the 5 pillars of Islam to enter paradise; Hindus believes in reincarnation depending on morals; Atheists believe that no matter what you rot in the ground, Christians go to heaven because they repent and trust Jesus because of what He did on the cross, etc etc), you can see that all of these claims are universal claims. All these groups are making claims of what happens to ALL people when they die. What happens here is that one's reality is in conflict with another's reality. Here's an example. I won't choose my own to make my point, I'll choose Islam and Hinduism. Here we have two different points of view. Now let's say there is a person who is a "good Muslim." What will happen to him? Will he go to paradise, or will he be reincarnated to something favorable? If he goes to paradise, then it means that Hindu's point of view is wrong. If he is reincarnated, then Islam's point of view is wrong. No matter how you put it, you will end up being either one of them being wrong or both of them being wrong, and that is the same result with different religions as well. Even if you are taking a different stance in terms of eternity, this stance should not even make sense. Either one group is right or everyone is wrong, but they cannot all be right. I'll go along with this scenario and pretend that I don't believe that Christianity is correct and considering other stances. If you look at all of these stances (Muslims need to follow the 5 pillars of Islam to enter paradise; Hindus believes in reincarnation depending on morals; Atheists believe that no matter what you rot in the ground, Christians go to heaven because they repent and trust Jesus because of what He did on the cross, etc etc), you can see that all of these claims are universal claims. All these groups are making claims of what happens to ALL people when they die. What happens here is that one's reality is in conflict with another's reality. Here's an example. I won't choose my own to make my point, I'll choose Islam and Hinduism. Here we have two different points of view. Now let's say there is a person who is a "good Muslim." What will happen to him? Will he go to paradise, or will he be reincarnated to something favorable? If he goes to paradise, then it means that Hindu's point of view is wrong. If he is reincarnated, then Islam's point of view is wrong. No matter how you put it, you will end up being either one of them being wrong or both of them being wrong, and that is the same result with different religions as well. Even if you are taking a different stance in terms of eternity, this stance should not even make sense. Either one group is right or everyone is wrong, but they cannot all be right. |
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05-13-11 05:39 AM
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hi this is just m opinon but i mean no disrespct or mean this in a bad way if it come out that way but all of the gods that they pray to could be the same person if you think bout it in every culture/religon is a heaven and hell maybe people perseave it as somthink else but in relity all the relgions are bout the same god and devil thats just my opion |
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05-13-11 09:50 AM
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nova777 : The problem with that is that all the religions teach different things and make different claims. For example, Christianity claims that Jesus is God, while Islam claims Jesus is just a prophet, Hindus believe in thousands and thousands of gods, while Atheists do not believe any gods exist. |
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05-13-11 10:44 AM
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yes i understand that but in each religeon there is always heaven and hell evil vs good so yea they hav difrent rituals but it dosent mean that there not the same person or entity |
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05-13-11 11:01 AM
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nova777 : no I'm not even talking about rituals. I mean what they believe about God is totally different. The claim of how they get to a spiritual realm is different. Some doesn't even have a good or evil in them, some don't even believe they would go anywhere after death. |
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05-13-11 11:34 AM
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I would have to say no, but I would like to think that each to his own would just keep everything alright.
I strongly agree with your statement: "The problem with that is that all the religions teach different things and make different claims." I strongly agree with your statement: "The problem with that is that all the religions teach different things and make different claims." |
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05-13-11 02:11 PM
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UserMike : Is it a problem that different groups believe different things? I mean, I look at this as a political thing. I believe that government should be limited and people should be allowed the freedom to choose things.
I know people, Elara for one, disagree with me and that doesn't make them wrong or me wrong. We just have different ideologies and different goals. Why shouldn't this relate directly to religions at the same time? It's all ideology. And I've enjoyed reading everyone's posts. You guys always give good answers when I post in this board. I know people, Elara for one, disagree with me and that doesn't make them wrong or me wrong. We just have different ideologies and different goals. Why shouldn't this relate directly to religions at the same time? It's all ideology. And I've enjoyed reading everyone's posts. You guys always give good answers when I post in this board. |
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05-13-11 02:12 PM
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05-13-11 02:44 PM
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warmaker : In politics, people disagree on ideologies on how a government should be practiced.(large government, small government, no government, etc) People can also disagree when we are talking about different ways to live your life, but here we are talking about proclaimed realities. We are not talking about art, our feelings, our ideologies, or anything that could be subjective. We are talking about what people would go to where when they die. These different religions claim or predict what they think will happen and all of these end results cannot happen at the same time, because they contradict one another.
Of course, you can agree and disagree with people, but don't say that everyone is going to be right in terms of reality and truth. Reality is different with ideology. Of course, you can agree and disagree with people, but don't say that everyone is going to be right in terms of reality and truth. Reality is different with ideology. |
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05-13-11 02:52 PM
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No We Cant Cause We have Never Seen him before...The Real Question Is..Is There Really a Hell And Is There Really Life After Death We Wont Know Till We Die I Guess Thats My Theroy |
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I don't know It might could happen. But who knows.I really believe there is a hell and there is a heaven. I'v always wondered about if there was a middle because my dad died 5 minutes but the lord brought him back to life.. he said he saw something but he still won't tell me the whole story. He just said there IS for a FACT something after death. |
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05-26-11 08:29 PM
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FIXED! What I should have said is that each religion is its own entity. It would be hasty and wrong to just group them all together and say that they're all right or all one in the same. It wouldn't make sense that different religions can all be right. However, there is a certain arrogance by those who believe that their religion is right while everyone else is wrong. One religion can't be proven more right over another though so trying is just a waste of time. I say just go with whatever suits you and don't brag about it. There's just as good a chance that we all just end up as nothing. FIXED! What I should have said is that each religion is its own entity. It would be hasty and wrong to just group them all together and say that they're all right or all one in the same. It wouldn't make sense that different religions can all be right. However, there is a certain arrogance by those who believe that their religion is right while everyone else is wrong. One religion can't be proven more right over another though so trying is just a waste of time. I say just go with whatever suits you and don't brag about it. There's just as good a chance that we all just end up as nothing. |
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(edited by NotJon on 05-27-11 03:28 PM)
05-27-11 02:32 AM
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NotJon : ...I wouldn't use Zeitgeist: The Movie as a source. The movie itself is controversial and has been criticized for factual inaccuracies in a scholarly point of view and discussion of conspiracy theories.
I'm no expert in Egyptian mythology, but watching the video itself, I can name a few errors: 1. Jesus was not a "Sun God." He created the sun, but the Sun is not God. The Bible also speaks against worshiping creation rather than the creator, which is distinguished from Pantheism and Panetheism. 2. Jesus was not born on December 25th. It is only the day set to celebrate His birth. 3. The Bible never stated 3 Kings came to see Jesus at His birth, another Christmas tradition error. 4. The biggest difference and the reason why Christianity differs from the rest of religions, is that Christianity is a grace-based religion, not a work-based religion to enter heaven. Every religion that has a specific afterlife tells followers to "do do do" and do your best so that you can get to heaven, where as Christianity says, you can't do anything to get to heaven, but it is all God's work and His grace. Simply put, it's "let go [of self-righteousness] and let God [pay it all]" I would point to this video from someone that I subscribed on youtube that talks about this issue concerning primary sources in egyptian mythology that shows some errors in terms of what they claim about Horus compared to Jesus: . I'm no expert in Egyptian mythology, but watching the video itself, I can name a few errors: 1. Jesus was not a "Sun God." He created the sun, but the Sun is not God. The Bible also speaks against worshiping creation rather than the creator, which is distinguished from Pantheism and Panetheism. 2. Jesus was not born on December 25th. It is only the day set to celebrate His birth. 3. The Bible never stated 3 Kings came to see Jesus at His birth, another Christmas tradition error. 4. The biggest difference and the reason why Christianity differs from the rest of religions, is that Christianity is a grace-based religion, not a work-based religion to enter heaven. Every religion that has a specific afterlife tells followers to "do do do" and do your best so that you can get to heaven, where as Christianity says, you can't do anything to get to heaven, but it is all God's work and His grace. Simply put, it's "let go [of self-righteousness] and let God [pay it all]" I would point to this video from someone that I subscribed on youtube that talks about this issue concerning primary sources in egyptian mythology that shows some errors in terms of what they claim about Horus compared to Jesus: . |
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05-27-11 12:46 PM
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play4fun : I didn't really look too into it. I just saw this and thought it was interesting. I really should have looked further into it. Thanks for clearing that up. |
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07-11-11 05:00 PM
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I think the problem with giving a blanketed "ok!" to all religious ideas is that instead of equalizing and justifying everyone beliefs, it just kind of cheapens it. There are other belief systems I could choose over Christianity that would make my life easier, in the sense of morality and duty. Showing conviction and taking a stance on your own faith shows quality, and is something that is sadly disappearing today.
That being said, I also believe God is extremely merciful, so I'm really not sure how deal with everyone from all walks of life in a completely just, and yet completely loving, way. I'm thankful that's not on my shoulders to decide. That being said, I also believe God is extremely merciful, so I'm really not sure how deal with everyone from all walks of life in a completely just, and yet completely loving, way. I'm thankful that's not on my shoulders to decide. |
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07-14-11 12:56 AM
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I don't personally believe that there are any correlations between the various gods of different religions, as there is way to many differences between them. Like play4fun said, there are major themes/ideas missing from some religions, such as heaven and hell.
There is a very interesting passage from the bible that deals with this topic though. Deuteronomy 32:8-9 (NRSV) 8When the Most High apportioned the nations, when he divided humankind, he fixed the boundaries of the peoples according to the number of the gods; 9 the Lord’s own portion was his people, Jacob his allotted share. Basically it is saying that the highest god appointed the other gods to specific nations. The lord ( Yahweh, the Lord of Israel, as it is read in some versions) was given Jacob and his people, otherwise known as Israel. Now this passage is very different depending on which version of the bible you read, a good place to see this would be http://bible.cc/deuteronomy/32-8.htm This site has the ability to show a specific passage in multiple bible versions. If you want to see Dueteronomy 32:9 just hit the right arrow where it says the title of the passage. Now most of you are probably saying that there is only 1 god in Christianity and Judaism, which is correct...today. Thousands of years ago when Judaism was first started they were polytheistic, or to be more accurate they were monolateral polytheistic. What I mean is that they acknowelged that there were more than one god but only chose (or in this example were appointed) to follow one of them. Centuries later they changed to monotheism, and Yahweh got attributed with what I know the above is off topic, so I won't show any other passages that suggest there are more than one god in Judaism. I just wanted to give a brief background on the transition from polytheism to monotheism to support that passage I quoted. NotJon : play4fun : NotJon mentioned that "many religions just rehash the same stories but change the names" which is very true. It may not be true in relation to Horus = Jesus, but there are many similar stories to previous religions. Some scholars have said Jesus was just a Hellenistic Greek motif that was used to portray the Judaic Messiah, but I havn't done much research in that area, another day perhaps. I will instead talk about the stories of genesis being similar to previous religions stories such as the creation of man and noah's flood. Epic of Gilgamesh The God Enki tells Utnapishtim to demolish his house and build a boat, regardless of the cost, to keep living beings alive. Utnapishtim finishes the boat and loads all of his livestock onto it. Then a different god, Shamash, from before tells him to seal the door as the time for the flood has come. On the seventh day of the flood , the storm calms and human kind has returned to clay. The epic of Gilgamesh is one of the earliest recorded stories in the world and predates the bible by many years. Mesopotamiam Creation Myths Ea, a God of fresh water , wanted to create beings that would do the work of the Gods for them. So Ea gathered clay from around his home and shaped them into humans. He gave them life by breathing upon them, but unlike Gods,these creatures had a finite lifespan. The first man was named Adapa, and Ea told him not to eat the fruit or he would become immortal. Later Anu, the sky God, says to Adapa something along the lines of "What you didn't want to become immortal like us?" implying that Ea tricked him. This myth , like the Gilgamesh tale, is also older than the bible, and there are many different versions of it found around Mesopotamia , but they are for the most part the same. I should note that the God Enki in Gilgamesh is the same God as Ea in the creation myth. One is Sumerian and the other is Akkadian, but both are the same thing. There is a very interesting passage from the bible that deals with this topic though. Deuteronomy 32:8-9 (NRSV) 8When the Most High apportioned the nations, when he divided humankind, he fixed the boundaries of the peoples according to the number of the gods; 9 the Lord’s own portion was his people, Jacob his allotted share. Basically it is saying that the highest god appointed the other gods to specific nations. The lord ( Yahweh, the Lord of Israel, as it is read in some versions) was given Jacob and his people, otherwise known as Israel. Now this passage is very different depending on which version of the bible you read, a good place to see this would be http://bible.cc/deuteronomy/32-8.htm This site has the ability to show a specific passage in multiple bible versions. If you want to see Dueteronomy 32:9 just hit the right arrow where it says the title of the passage. Now most of you are probably saying that there is only 1 god in Christianity and Judaism, which is correct...today. Thousands of years ago when Judaism was first started they were polytheistic, or to be more accurate they were monolateral polytheistic. What I mean is that they acknowelged that there were more than one god but only chose (or in this example were appointed) to follow one of them. Centuries later they changed to monotheism, and Yahweh got attributed with what I know the above is off topic, so I won't show any other passages that suggest there are more than one god in Judaism. I just wanted to give a brief background on the transition from polytheism to monotheism to support that passage I quoted. NotJon : play4fun : NotJon mentioned that "many religions just rehash the same stories but change the names" which is very true. It may not be true in relation to Horus = Jesus, but there are many similar stories to previous religions. Some scholars have said Jesus was just a Hellenistic Greek motif that was used to portray the Judaic Messiah, but I havn't done much research in that area, another day perhaps. I will instead talk about the stories of genesis being similar to previous religions stories such as the creation of man and noah's flood. Epic of Gilgamesh The God Enki tells Utnapishtim to demolish his house and build a boat, regardless of the cost, to keep living beings alive. Utnapishtim finishes the boat and loads all of his livestock onto it. Then a different god, Shamash, from before tells him to seal the door as the time for the flood has come. On the seventh day of the flood , the storm calms and human kind has returned to clay. The epic of Gilgamesh is one of the earliest recorded stories in the world and predates the bible by many years. Mesopotamiam Creation Myths Ea, a God of fresh water , wanted to create beings that would do the work of the Gods for them. So Ea gathered clay from around his home and shaped them into humans. He gave them life by breathing upon them, but unlike Gods,these creatures had a finite lifespan. The first man was named Adapa, and Ea told him not to eat the fruit or he would become immortal. Later Anu, the sky God, says to Adapa something along the lines of "What you didn't want to become immortal like us?" implying that Ea tricked him. This myth , like the Gilgamesh tale, is also older than the bible, and there are many different versions of it found around Mesopotamia , but they are for the most part the same. I should note that the God Enki in Gilgamesh is the same God as Ea in the creation myth. One is Sumerian and the other is Akkadian, but both are the same thing. |
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No I am sorry but it is not possible that would be like saying that taking a one way path to a place that has no other roads that are going to or fro, yet you are talking a different road to the same place. That is not possible... |
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3rd place in the August 2011 VCS! I got 3rd place in the October 2010 VCS! 3DS friend code 1762-2680-4239 pm me yours |
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I don't see how these beliefs could fit together. They all contradict each other in some ways, whether its view on death or Jesus or reincarnation. |
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