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Is Evolution compatible with Christianity?

 

05-28-10 02:32 AM
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I am interested to see if people here that think that Evolution is compatible with Christianity. The debate about Evolution itself can be done in a different thread, but this is strictly about the compatibility between Evolution and Christianity (not Christianity and Science) Please back up with scientific, scriptural, or philosophical evidence to back up with your claim.

I will give my backings later, but my position is that Evolution cannot be compatible with Christianity. I believe that this is where a Christian needs to make a choice between these two, especially when the Bible makes a clear case that it does not support an evolution-driven creation.


1. We are talking about macro-evolution.
2. AGAIN, we are not arguing about whether evolution is true. We are arguing whether evolution is compatible with Christianity and the Bible.
3. Need support. Make the connection between the Bible and the science or the philosophical arguments for evolution.
I am interested to see if people here that think that Evolution is compatible with Christianity. The debate about Evolution itself can be done in a different thread, but this is strictly about the compatibility between Evolution and Christianity (not Christianity and Science) Please back up with scientific, scriptural, or philosophical evidence to back up with your claim.

I will give my backings later, but my position is that Evolution cannot be compatible with Christianity. I believe that this is where a Christian needs to make a choice between these two, especially when the Bible makes a clear case that it does not support an evolution-driven creation.


1. We are talking about macro-evolution.
2. AGAIN, we are not arguing about whether evolution is true. We are arguing whether evolution is compatible with Christianity and the Bible.
3. Need support. Make the connection between the Bible and the science or the philosophical arguments for evolution.
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(edited by play4fun on 05-28-10 04:51 PM)    

05-28-10 09:39 AM
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I do no believe at all that evolution is compatible with the bible. In the bible, everything comes about spontaneous and in 7 day's not in billions of years of death and evolution, plus aside from that, you cannot call yourself a christian if you don't hold the bible as absolute truth, and if you believe in evolution than you do not hold the bible as absolute truth.
I do no believe at all that evolution is compatible with the bible. In the bible, everything comes about spontaneous and in 7 day's not in billions of years of death and evolution, plus aside from that, you cannot call yourself a christian if you don't hold the bible as absolute truth, and if you believe in evolution than you do not hold the bible as absolute truth.
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"you cannot call yourself a christian if you don't hold the bible as absolute truth"

Did Jesus say that?
"you cannot call yourself a christian if you don't hold the bible as absolute truth"

Did Jesus say that?
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05-28-10 02:40 PM
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Hoochman : Oh and seven days for an infinite omnipotent being is the same for mere mortals? 7 days for a god could translate into 7 billion years for a human.

I absolutely think that evolution is compatible with Christianity. God could have used planned it out that way or just let everything run its course.
Hoochman : Oh and seven days for an infinite omnipotent being is the same for mere mortals? 7 days for a god could translate into 7 billion years for a human.

I absolutely think that evolution is compatible with Christianity. God could have used planned it out that way or just let everything run its course.
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Everything about us sure seems like evolution to me. God didn't give us our fancy laptops and cars out of the blue it took generations to get where we are today. How can sperm turn into flesh, blood, and bones? That seems like evolution too. The bible was rewritten or rephrased over time so that alone can be also considered evolution because its changing face of the bible. So if you think about it, evolution and christianity should relate. You also have to consider God did not create a bible with the earth; people did so turning words into the form of paper is also evolution. Then what mel gibson did was turn paper into screen, another form of evolution.

Blacks use to be slaves, jews use to get executed, kids use to say the pledge in school, times change that is for sure so no debating evolution does not exist because it does through generations. Just like a baby you are not born 100% complete you grow or evolve in time.

Genetic mutation does exists, might not be as extreme as monkey into man but there are changes going on you cannot see. Mothers and Fathers pass traits to their childs so that is evolution before your very eyes We have also seen a ton of new creatures that have taken shape of other animals lately.
Everything about us sure seems like evolution to me. God didn't give us our fancy laptops and cars out of the blue it took generations to get where we are today. How can sperm turn into flesh, blood, and bones? That seems like evolution too. The bible was rewritten or rephrased over time so that alone can be also considered evolution because its changing face of the bible. So if you think about it, evolution and christianity should relate. You also have to consider God did not create a bible with the earth; people did so turning words into the form of paper is also evolution. Then what mel gibson did was turn paper into screen, another form of evolution.

Blacks use to be slaves, jews use to get executed, kids use to say the pledge in school, times change that is for sure so no debating evolution does not exist because it does through generations. Just like a baby you are not born 100% complete you grow or evolve in time.

Genetic mutation does exists, might not be as extreme as monkey into man but there are changes going on you cannot see. Mothers and Fathers pass traits to their childs so that is evolution before your very eyes We have also seen a ton of new creatures that have taken shape of other animals lately.
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05-28-10 06:31 PM
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ummm...everyone, we need a little bit more than just "Evolution and Christianity are compatible" and "Evolution and Christianity are incompatible." Remember we need some support for each position. Try to put scriptural evidence with scientific and philosophical evidence together. (read my clarifications on the top)

Maybe I'll just start. Marco-evolution is the change from one species to another. This is not how the Bible describes how the world is made. If you read in Genesis, everything is created "according to its kind" (Genesis 1:21; 1:24; 7:14)

Also, there have been many discussion about what the word "day" means in Genesis 1. This is because in order for marcoevolution is possible, there is must be millions and billions of years in order for the process to work. Going back to the original text, the Hebrew word used in this verse is "yom." It is true that this word can mean "ions," or a literal "day." However, we cannot smash any meaning into the verse just because it actually means that. Example: When I say "trunk," it could mean "tree trunk" or an "elephant trunk." But when placed in a sentence, "it's trunk just grabbed me," based on context, it cannot be a "tree trunk."

In the same way, we cannot decide the meaning of a word that can mean different portions of time if we did not look at the context in the first place. Now, going back to Genesis 1, each day of creation is attached with a description for the passing of a day, which is written that "there was evening, and there was morning." That type of description is pretty clear that it is describing a literal day.

Let's look at a different context using the same word, "yom." If we look at Genesis 1:14, “Then God said, “Let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs and seasons, and for days and years;” Here the word "yom" is used in this verse. The description of the division of day and night and this being the usage for signs and seasons, days and years, is not exactly describing "ions." Light is used for us to divide day and night. and a day is for us to divide our seasons and days and years. Day is the unit we have here.

Finally, if these do not persuade you, the word "yom" has been used 2301 times in the old testament alone. ALL of them according to the context of the verse, is describing a literal day.

Still more to come...
ummm...everyone, we need a little bit more than just "Evolution and Christianity are compatible" and "Evolution and Christianity are incompatible." Remember we need some support for each position. Try to put scriptural evidence with scientific and philosophical evidence together. (read my clarifications on the top)

Maybe I'll just start. Marco-evolution is the change from one species to another. This is not how the Bible describes how the world is made. If you read in Genesis, everything is created "according to its kind" (Genesis 1:21; 1:24; 7:14)

Also, there have been many discussion about what the word "day" means in Genesis 1. This is because in order for marcoevolution is possible, there is must be millions and billions of years in order for the process to work. Going back to the original text, the Hebrew word used in this verse is "yom." It is true that this word can mean "ions," or a literal "day." However, we cannot smash any meaning into the verse just because it actually means that. Example: When I say "trunk," it could mean "tree trunk" or an "elephant trunk." But when placed in a sentence, "it's trunk just grabbed me," based on context, it cannot be a "tree trunk."

In the same way, we cannot decide the meaning of a word that can mean different portions of time if we did not look at the context in the first place. Now, going back to Genesis 1, each day of creation is attached with a description for the passing of a day, which is written that "there was evening, and there was morning." That type of description is pretty clear that it is describing a literal day.

Let's look at a different context using the same word, "yom." If we look at Genesis 1:14, “Then God said, “Let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs and seasons, and for days and years;” Here the word "yom" is used in this verse. The description of the division of day and night and this being the usage for signs and seasons, days and years, is not exactly describing "ions." Light is used for us to divide day and night. and a day is for us to divide our seasons and days and years. Day is the unit we have here.

Finally, if these do not persuade you, the word "yom" has been used 2301 times in the old testament alone. ALL of them according to the context of the verse, is describing a literal day.

Still more to come...
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(edited by play4fun on 05-28-10 06:57 PM)    

05-28-10 07:29 PM
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Zamiel : No Zamiel, the billions of years of creation is not at all compatible with the bible. When the bible say's 7 day's, it meant 7 literal 24 hour day's.
Zamiel : No Zamiel, the billions of years of creation is not at all compatible with the bible. When the bible say's 7 day's, it meant 7 literal 24 hour day's.
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oh, I forgot to vote.

I say no, evolution is not compatible with Christianity. At least not with the young-earth creationist view-point. There is WAY too much evidence relating to the age of the earth that makes the young-earth point of view absurd.
oh, I forgot to vote.

I say no, evolution is not compatible with Christianity. At least not with the young-earth creationist view-point. There is WAY too much evidence relating to the age of the earth that makes the young-earth point of view absurd.
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If all humans and animals were made in 7 days all at same time... how do you explain humans surviving the very thing that killed all dinosaurs? That's a mystery isn't it? It makes you wonder that God was not here first something or someone else was here before him and there is no denying that. Its kinda why I look at God as an alien who was beta testing with dinosaurs, didn't like them, killed them all and started over.
If all humans and animals were made in 7 days all at same time... how do you explain humans surviving the very thing that killed all dinosaurs? That's a mystery isn't it? It makes you wonder that God was not here first something or someone else was here before him and there is no denying that. Its kinda why I look at God as an alien who was beta testing with dinosaurs, didn't like them, killed them all and started over.
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JigSaw : well obviously it was the flood that killed the dinosaurs and Noah survived that...

Go read the bible... jeez
JigSaw : well obviously it was the flood that killed the dinosaurs and Noah survived that...

Go read the bible... jeez
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Hoochman : Then why not just make everything in one day? Doesn't make sense to spread it out over seven days when everything could have been made in an instant. This tells me that the way god made the universe was to place all the materials needed, start the whole process, and then just let everything run it's course. I don't give a crap if it's compatible with the bible or not. What matters is if it's compatible with reason. (I know someone's going to use some bible verse to counter argue my point )
Hoochman : Then why not just make everything in one day? Doesn't make sense to spread it out over seven days when everything could have been made in an instant. This tells me that the way god made the universe was to place all the materials needed, start the whole process, and then just let everything run it's course. I don't give a crap if it's compatible with the bible or not. What matters is if it's compatible with reason. (I know someone's going to use some bible verse to counter argue my point )
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That sounds like a fairy tail... 1 man survived a flood that killed an entire population of animals? If it was indeed a flood that doesn't explain why sea dinosaurs died too. I guess this Noah person was a great swimmer to survive something like that.
That sounds like a fairy tail... 1 man survived a flood that killed an entire population of animals? If it was indeed a flood that doesn't explain why sea dinosaurs died too. I guess this Noah person was a great swimmer to survive something like that.
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It's interesting that I should find this topic today, because I just answered this question myself just recently.

Here's what I think: nowhere in the Bible does it say that the creatures of the Earth did *not* change.

Now, in the Garden of Eden it's basically a paradise. As far as we know, nothing died there. However, after sin was introduced into the world, death followed. So now we have a lot of animals that are going to die, need to be able to prevent it, but can't because they weren't built to kill. They were built for a paradise.

So they adapt. They adapt survival tactics and skills. Claws enter the genetic stream, colors change into camouflage, they learn how to eat new things. They have a *reason* to evolve.

Again, the Bible does not say that the animals have never changed. It does not say that nothing has ever gone extinct. It may even mention dinosaurs. So all in all, I do think that evolution fits in perfectly with Biblical beliefs on the origin of life.

God could have created each animal separately in seven days, but that doesn't stop them from having evolved, and I have no idea why the evolutionists I talk to seem to think so. I even ask them and they don't tell me. Could someone please answer this question for me while I'm here?
It's interesting that I should find this topic today, because I just answered this question myself just recently.

Here's what I think: nowhere in the Bible does it say that the creatures of the Earth did *not* change.

Now, in the Garden of Eden it's basically a paradise. As far as we know, nothing died there. However, after sin was introduced into the world, death followed. So now we have a lot of animals that are going to die, need to be able to prevent it, but can't because they weren't built to kill. They were built for a paradise.

So they adapt. They adapt survival tactics and skills. Claws enter the genetic stream, colors change into camouflage, they learn how to eat new things. They have a *reason* to evolve.

Again, the Bible does not say that the animals have never changed. It does not say that nothing has ever gone extinct. It may even mention dinosaurs. So all in all, I do think that evolution fits in perfectly with Biblical beliefs on the origin of life.

God could have created each animal separately in seven days, but that doesn't stop them from having evolved, and I have no idea why the evolutionists I talk to seem to think so. I even ask them and they don't tell me. Could someone please answer this question for me while I'm here?
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Zamiel : If you read the title of this thread, that is what we are talking about.

Crawldragon : That is an interesting theory. This is the first time that I have heard of that...However, there are a few things.

Evolution needs a long period of time (millions and billions). Now if you are saying that animals start to evolve after the fall, the genealogies in Genesis and in Matthew would not add up to that high of a time period.

This would make the "death after the fall" scenario to support a Young Earth Creation view, because evolution also requires death in order to occur.

Finally, it said written that birds and water animals were made in the fifth day, and land animals and Adam and Eve were made in the sixth day. Now with this view, are you saying that you do not believe that humans are evolved?
Zamiel : If you read the title of this thread, that is what we are talking about.

Crawldragon : That is an interesting theory. This is the first time that I have heard of that...However, there are a few things.

Evolution needs a long period of time (millions and billions). Now if you are saying that animals start to evolve after the fall, the genealogies in Genesis and in Matthew would not add up to that high of a time period.

This would make the "death after the fall" scenario to support a Young Earth Creation view, because evolution also requires death in order to occur.

Finally, it said written that birds and water animals were made in the fifth day, and land animals and Adam and Eve were made in the sixth day. Now with this view, are you saying that you do not believe that humans are evolved?
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play4fun : No, it says "Christianity" not the "bible". While the bible is important to Christianity it does not equal it. There are things in the bible that today's Christians do not follow. Why? Because it's not reasonable or is not compatible with today's society. There are going to be mistakes and misinformation in the bible. It was written by man.
play4fun : No, it says "Christianity" not the "bible". While the bible is important to Christianity it does not equal it. There are things in the bible that today's Christians do not follow. Why? Because it's not reasonable or is not compatible with today's society. There are going to be mistakes and misinformation in the bible. It was written by man.
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Zamiel : Now that does not make sense. Christians believe that Bible is the inspired Word of God. Christianity is here because we are blessed to have the Bible. So that is why the thread is about whether Christianity and Evolution can be compatible. We are talking about whether the claims in Christianity can be compatible with Evolution. I am expecting responses from this thread to see if evolution can be correlated with the claims of the Bible.
Zamiel : Now that does not make sense. Christians believe that Bible is the inspired Word of God. Christianity is here because we are blessed to have the Bible. So that is why the thread is about whether Christianity and Evolution can be compatible. We are talking about whether the claims in Christianity can be compatible with Evolution. I am expecting responses from this thread to see if evolution can be correlated with the claims of the Bible.
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play4fun : You're not understanding what I am saying. The bible is a big part of Christianity but not everything in the bible is taken word for word by the Christian community. If I recall correctly men are supposed to wear four tassels on their throat, women aren't supposed to preach, and other stuff I can't quite remember at the moment

Although in your list on the first post you said Christianity and the bible so I'll just let this argument die since I realize that it's not really relevant to the topic.
play4fun : You're not understanding what I am saying. The bible is a big part of Christianity but not everything in the bible is taken word for word by the Christian community. If I recall correctly men are supposed to wear four tassels on their throat, women aren't supposed to preach, and other stuff I can't quite remember at the moment

Although in your list on the first post you said Christianity and the bible so I'll just let this argument die since I realize that it's not really relevant to the topic.
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Zamiel : You people really need to quit it with trying to get me to decipher Gods motives. No evolution does not make sense because the idea that everything now came from chance and accident is absurd.
Zamiel : You people really need to quit it with trying to get me to decipher Gods motives. No evolution does not make sense because the idea that everything now came from chance and accident is absurd.
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Zamiel : Got it. We'll leave it at that. This is more of a "in house" debate. I personally believe that there are some Christians claim that Evolution is compatible with Christianity just because the world makes it sound like fact, and they are trying to make them compatible so that people can see that Christianity is not different, and that you can be both. But if you look at the two claims, I don't think you could put the two together.
Zamiel : Got it. We'll leave it at that. This is more of a "in house" debate. I personally believe that there are some Christians claim that Evolution is compatible with Christianity just because the world makes it sound like fact, and they are trying to make them compatible so that people can see that Christianity is not different, and that you can be both. But if you look at the two claims, I don't think you could put the two together.
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play4fun :

Evolution needs a long period of time (millions and billions). Now if you are saying that animals start to evolve after the fall, the genealogies in Genesis and in Matthew would not add up to that high of a time period.

I fail to see why evolution "requires" a long period of time. It only took a couple of days for moths to change color to adapt to ash dumps, and only a hundred years for moths to grow in Hawai'i that eat bananas. They've had 6,000 years so far.

Finally, it said written that birds and water animals were made in the fifth day, and land animals and Adam and Eve were made in the sixth day. Now with this view, are you saying that you do not believe that humans are evolved?

Our closest ancestors eat their own poop and they still have prehensile tails and opposable thumbs. If you think about it, humans are a really crappy species: our only real advantage over other species is that we're (supposedly) smarter.

Besides, evolution scientists claim that sharks haven't evolved for millions of years and trilobites stayed the same for about the same amount of time. I dont' see why that wouldn't apply to humans.
play4fun :

Evolution needs a long period of time (millions and billions). Now if you are saying that animals start to evolve after the fall, the genealogies in Genesis and in Matthew would not add up to that high of a time period.

I fail to see why evolution "requires" a long period of time. It only took a couple of days for moths to change color to adapt to ash dumps, and only a hundred years for moths to grow in Hawai'i that eat bananas. They've had 6,000 years so far.

Finally, it said written that birds and water animals were made in the fifth day, and land animals and Adam and Eve were made in the sixth day. Now with this view, are you saying that you do not believe that humans are evolved?

Our closest ancestors eat their own poop and they still have prehensile tails and opposable thumbs. If you think about it, humans are a really crappy species: our only real advantage over other species is that we're (supposedly) smarter.

Besides, evolution scientists claim that sharks haven't evolved for millions of years and trilobites stayed the same for about the same amount of time. I dont' see why that wouldn't apply to humans.
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