I've been talking about autism with a few people lately and it got me thinking about my experiences with the Christian churches. Namely, with the Reverends(I'm using this in place of Clergy of all Christian Denominations).

A few Reverends claim that Autism is a demon. A good number claim that any neuro-psychological  issues are demons.

From what I gather is that God has power over the womb (ESV) and that whatever happens in the womb is God's Work. Autism is formed in the womb (ESV). So God must either cause or allow Autism to exist for a purpose that the rest of us are unwilling to look into (folks rather "fix" autism rather than see if it actually benefits the world).

I would like to know what other Christian and non-Christians believe, but especially Christians, which is why I'm posting it here.

I ask that all respondents do the following:

• Link or post bible verses or other religious texts and classify them as their version, translation, or book  (eg. Mark 12:28-34 ESV; Luke 10:25-28 NLT;   Ibrahim 14:37; "He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love." 1 John 4:8 KJV)
• Put down what religion or domination you are (Baptist; Catholic; Buddhist; Wiccan). If your non-denominational, Atheist or Agnostic, please put down so.
• If you are a clergy member please tell me.
• link any non-religious texts that you think supports your perceptive, if there are any. If not don't sweat it. I still want to know your view.
  

Thank You!

I'm a Philosopher

Wait what? This is a rare find you have here. I'm pretty much confused since facts like this not a lot of people would think its real of some sort. How did you come to gain this knowledge and finding out information about it?

Eniitan :

First, sorry for being late to reply. I managed to miss your notification.

Second,  about how I get info. I went to college as a psychological statistician with a concentration in Social Work.  There I picked up on skills of finding and reading studies regarding both medical and social issues. Autism Speaks  is one of the front runners for autistic research and their goal is to end the ignorance and discrimination towards those with Autism Spectrum Disorder (ASD). Even as I travel I have a few colleagues who keep me up on date via SMS (text messages).

The religious aspect of my claim here comes from both personal talks with certain reverends and with autistic Christians who have come under fire for their issues.

My bible knowledge comes from Orphan background, but I'm pretty knowledgeable of the Eight Fold Path and Quran. I'm currently studying the book of Mormon and other mainstream texts.

I hope this thread will shed light on the matter and give the different sides of the argument a chance to explain their reasoning.  Thus, allowing all of us to understand one another.

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH freaking autism demons man BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Yo i'm like agnostic. I don't really know. From what I know people use excuses- er I mean say that "God gave us free will".
Actually autism occurs from abnormalities in the brain. Autism usually occurs in the womb because it's when the brain is growing and overall just manifesting itself, which does cause abnormalities. Autism isn't something to be fixed, just accepted. And autism can be caused by a traumatic experience of the like as well.

Also freaking autism demons BAAHAHAH.

WandererExiled : I'm sorry to say I won't be able to believe it....facts like this shouldn't be said if not being able to believe the truth of it. I hope you can forgive me...I have had the time to think about this before replying back to the thread...

Eniitan :

No need for forgiveness. Each person has his or her right to have their view. I believe in open discussions that allow people to voice themselves without repercussions. One of my favorite philosophy quotes is "A mark of an educated man [or woman] is one who can entertain a notion without necessarily accepting it."  by Aristotle.

May I ask what particular facts you are having issues believing? If it's the study itself I may be able to provide more info that may explain why they came up with that -- if you desire it.

It sounds like you're taking the Logical stance but just for clarification: Are there any religious beliefs that are be factored into your view? 

WandererExiled :

Since you're a philosopher, read my text as you would Aristotle. I am largely Aristotelian.

I'm curious about how to interpret biblical demons myself. One way is to say that all mental defects are "demons". This is slightly attractive to me because mental defects are not material in nature, but are due to poor form/organization of the brain (largely with chemical receptors). This would make "demons" immaterial, yet fixable by a kind of psychological attack. This would correspond with Jesus' and the apostles healing people with "demons" and their improved mental capacities. Genetic defects or accidents would not be "demons".

Yet this also strikes me as a stretch of the biblical text. I don't want to make the bible into a Rorschach test for my Aristotelian presuppositions. But, to answer the common interpretation of demons, I find it pretty ridiculous. With what body do these spirits "move" in? With what eyes do they see? The attributes of the body are often applied to the spirit, and this is nonsensical.

So, as for autism being a possession of a being to make someone socially awkward, that's... well.... awkward. But, if we call any mental defect a "demon", then ADHD also is a "demon", etc etc.

WandererExiled :   Just as a quick side note and I honestly don't want to put a trip on anyone, but I always wondered about this.  Why the title "Reverend" (worthy of reverence) or even "Your Eminence" ( A position of great distinction or superiority) ?  Why does some ministers insist on these titles?  The only Person in my opinion, that is "worthy of reverence" and have the utmost position of great distinction or superiority is Jesus Christ (Revelation 4:11 - “You are worthy, O Lord, To receive glory and honor and power; For You created all things, And by Your will they exist and were created."

OK moving on.  I haven't had any experience or exposure to someone with autism, so I'm not even going to pretend to know what I'm talking about.  However, my wife is a teacher with a degree in educational psychology and she had extensive experience with kids with this disorder, so it is from that angle where I am coming from.  Looking at this from a Christian perspective, I can understand that this condition will make it particularly difficult for individuals to obey God in specific ways.  For example - It may affect how a person shows love (to others and to Him) God wishes for us or it can even make it hard to forgive others and have healthy relationships, which is the foundation of the Christian life.  This might also make certain scriptural guidelines harder to live up to, specifically guidelines regarding what the Bible says about appropriate behavior and feelings.  In the Bible you can read in detail in Genesis about the Original Sin, but in short - when Adam sinned, death entered the world.  Adam and Eve were expelled from the garden of Eden as they had exchanged their life in paradise for a curse.  They were cursed, their bodies were cursed and the earth was cursed.  Thousands of years and hundreds of generations later, we are the heirs of that curse.  Our bodies, despite medical science, are even more susceptible to disease than Adam and Eve's were.  Our DNA after generations of radiation an chemical exposure is riddled with defects.  Our society is so saturated with sin and our souls are so easily trapped that our actions can alter our physiology in such a way that sin becomes even more natural.



This however is no surprise to God.  He knows that our sin and physiology are sometimes connected.  God acknowledges this in Genesis 3:16 when He told Eve that her sin would affect the relationship between women and their husbands.  God knows that sin - whether our own sin or the sin of others -  can change us in such a way that following His standards become more difficult as I have already mentioned.  Despite all of this the thing to realize is these mental conditions is nothing compared to the power, love and grace of God.  Romans 8:38-39 says, "For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus, our Lord."  God knows our physical state and our difficulties and He knows our mental and emotional capacities, but we are ALL pre-conditioned to sin.  God knows our limitations, but as a Christian, you are still expected to obey Him.  He knows our starting point as damaged people and His promises of hope and healing are just as applicable to someone with autism or another mental disorder as they are to anyone else.  Once again - everyone on this planet is predisposed to rebel against God and live a life of sin.  Sometimes that predisposition has a name and medical significance and sometimes it doesn't.  However, in God's eyes there are only two types of people - those who have accepted Jesus Christ as their savior and those who haven't.  No brain chemistry, no imperfect mental development and no emotional damage can keep us from the love of God.  Only continued rejection of His offer of salvation. God knows our weaknesses and salvation is not based on our strengths - it is based on His.

So now that I'm done with my foreword...   Hopefully it is more clear from a Christian point of view, how these mental disorders should be approached.  Regarding the "Reverends" claiming that Autism is a demon - In my personal opinion as a Christian, I think it is naive, unfair, sad and even more damaging towards a person suffering from autism by making such..such less intelligent remarks.  They are giving Satan way too much credit.


"One of my favorite philosophy quotes is "A mark of an educated man [or woman] is one who can entertain a notion without necessarily accepting it."  by Aristotle."


This proves that Aristotle was a Troll


Another one of my side notes - No disrespect and I'm not putting down the years of hard work and study, but the problem with philosophy is that it is man's ideas and thinking, trying to "formulate" life and sometimes even God.  It has been and always will be a recipe for disaster.  I would rather suggest pursuing God's thinking and what He wants from your life.  Pick up the Bible rather and start with the book of John and put down the book of Mormon and the Eight fold path.  This is the mark of a wise man - one who seeks the truth and accepts it wholeheartedly when he finds it.


"Buy the truth, and do not sell it, Also wisdom and instruction and understanding." - Proverbs 23:23

It is wonderful! And I could hurt anyone who opposes autism because I sir am autistic!

Long Live the Puzzle Pieces!

Police officers tase, shoot and clobber autistic people when they are scared! and police officers just don't freaking care!!

Post deleted because of funky double post. Sorry about that!

Txgangsta :

Because of the length of this post I'm dedicating this post to just answering you and will answer everyone else in another post. No body get upset off with me on this, Please.

I've done as you asked and interpreted your comment via how I perceive Aristotle would have. The first part is an interpretation via philosophy and historical significance. The second is taking the first and applying it to an conclusion. Please, bear in mind that this does not necessarily reflect my personal beliefs on the matter. My "entertaining the notion" if you will.

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The origin of demon is "δαίμων" (daimōn) literally it meant "godlike power, fate, god". This word basically figuratively meant "Natrual spirits of great power" when used to describe something. However, it was generally used in a similar fashion as to how we use "Ghost" (and the interpretations were just about the same as the interpretations implied to ghosts today). Later Greek, the kind spoken by Alexander the Great (and thus Aristotle), was Koine. In Koine, daimōn was elevated to an umbrella term (much like "Human"). Under this, there were many different words, but the most used (and generally accepted) were ἀγαθοδαίμων (agathodaimōn "noble spirit") and κακός (kakós "bad, evil") {you can views these as "races" of Daimōn just we have races of Humans}. We'll come back to this after I've laid other factors down first.

Now a strict "classical" view of demons. I'll be taking a descendant approach:
Through Plato, we know that Socrates was arrested for "not believe[ing] in the gods in whom the city believes, but introduc[ing] other daemonic beings...". Socrates himself used daimōn as a term for the human mind -- particularly for the human conscientious (what the spirit/soul and what some Christians may call the "Holy Spirit"). Plato, a student of Socrates, placed daimōn as a "Guardian Being of a higher stage of self" (we would best understand this as a "Guardian Angel"). Aristotle went one step further and changed daimōn into something different. To him, daimōn was a middle-ground spirit to 'gods' (what we would consider as "angels").

Now that we've covered that, we can return to Koine Greek and it's play on things. As you may know, Alexander the Great was responsible for conquering all the known world at the time (including Israel the Middle East). Because he accomplished this, Koine Greek became the main language of business, and remain so until the middle of the Byzantine Empire reign (After which Late Latin took over). [To add more depth, the language became the official world language like English did after the British World Conquest ended.] Now, keeping in mind that Koine Greek was the world Language, and was heavily promoted by the successors of Alexander until 31 B.C. (64 years before Christianity). This will make it very understandable when one realizes that THIS was the Greek that the Gospels were written in and is still used by the Greek Unorthodox Catholic Church today (thanks to the Byzantine Empire).

As a philosopher, you should know that science was born from "natural philosophy" and that Psychology was born from the scientific interpretations of the mind. With this in place let us move unto the next stage of the argument.
Now in Psychological terms, a "daimon" is the natural impulse to increase the human self (here the totality of the human psyche) to the highest level of existential self-awareness [link to picture]. [After referring to the picture, bear in mind a new level call "self-transcendence" was added. Self-transcendence is "the individual's own needs are put aside, to a great extent, in favor of service to others" and presides over 'Self-actualization'.] We can achieve this either creatively (taking pain and using it to improve) or destructively (causing pain in order to gain improvement {can't reach Self-transcendence with this, though}).
This where we get "Battling one's demons". In the sense of that phrase and the psychological term, the demon is the crisis that we face when we reach a point in our lives where we must move up in the pyramid and choose either (a) build upon our experiences in a good way, (b) cheat our way up by disregarding everyone (selfish ambition), (c) ignore it and be stuck in the current level.

Now we move unto the "realities". I'll be combining both Aristotle and Plato's interpretations for the purpose of this argument. In very a basic sense, There is a "main" essence that all things are copies of. The difference between Plato and Aristotle is that Plato believed the "Essence" existed outside of this World and in another, and Aristotle Believed that the "Essence" existed only inside the objects. (To Christians, this would be saying that God --who is the essence-- lives in Heaven {outside our world}, but when we accept him he enters inside {existing inside us}).

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Imagine a piece of software that is perfect in all means. It happens to reside in a super-computer that is on the International Space Station. It is transferred (in entirety) to Earth (it's first copy). It is by far the most popular software but it can only be downloaded by a copy on Earth and only through subsequent copies (because the First copy was lost/deleted). However, with each download, packets of information is lost so that it starts to become corrupted. At first this doesn't effect functionality because the information lost is not 100% crucial. Though, as more downloads are made and preceding copies are lost/deleted the corruption begins to show. This creates bugs and limits the functionality of the software A LOT. Sometimes to the point where the only thing you can do is just look at the non-responsiveness.
With this thought, it's easy to see how God is the "Perfect Software" (and the main programmer) and that the generations of humans, and their small losses of respect for God and genetic strain, are the slowly corrupting copies. But we can't stop there. We have to see what the biblical demons are.

According to our word demon (root word "daimōn"), there is a third party involved and there's also an "inside programming" to blame. Lets say that there's Astronauts that go up and down between the "Main Software". There's some who believe the software should be shared (angels) and there's those who do not (demons). However, there's an AI (artificial intelligence) that controls the way the software works (we'll call this our soul) which is activated by another AI(Mind). After accepting that there is a corruption and realizing we need the "main coding" to be fully healed, the Angel Astronauts download the fixing code --and if it fails and the program dies transports the copy back up to the main computer. However, the Demonic Astronauts try to hack into the software (thus controlling it) and destroy it, until anti-hackers step in (exorcism).

The AI(soul) can, if given the fixing coding (Holy Spirit), repair itself to at least 99% fixablity but it has to continuously fight off hacking attempts (temptations) which slows down repairs. However, some hardware (the body) damages caused by the corruption may stay and with or without the ability to being fixed.

Thus, depending on interpretation and school of thought, Autism --like any other nuerophysical disorder-- is not a Demon (bad spirit) but rather the after effect of a demonic attack (sin), which may or not have happened before the current copy. However, non-physical disorders, may be interpreted as demonic possessions, such as a loving mother who suddenly cracked and killed all her kids and husband and maybe a couple of neighbors.

Again, not necessarily my view or belief but my philosophical interpretation using the factors I listed.

(fun fact: It took 1298 words and 7806 characters to write this post. I just achieved College Paper level on a forum lol)

SoL@R :

No disrespect seen. As I have said, each has the right to their own views and I like an open area to allow people to voice it.

I will break this down into three parts to address all points brought forth. Also for all the verses I use as support, I encourage you to read the chapter preceding it, the chapter itself, and the chapter after. So you can get a fuller picture.  I say this because many bibles break up Jesus’ sermon and teachings –like the Sermon on the Mount— and Letters into several chapters, when in reality it’s one long sitting/teaching.

“Why does some ministers insist on these titles?”

I always wondered that too until I realized that it’s a Sin.  As a follower of Christ, one is not allowed to take on titles, including disciple of Christ. Hence, the reason why the Apostles called themselves “commissioned” (which is the meaning of Apostle). They were basically saying that they had been given a job by Christ. We are allowed to acknowledge if someone else calls us a Follower/Christian/Disciple but never refer to ourselves by any such thing. And only then it should be based on our actions.

Versus I draw this from:

Matthew 23  -- Particularly versus 8-12 (Jesus)

Matthew 20: 25-28 (Jesus)

Mark 10: 35-45 (Jesus)

John 15 (Jesus) I personally believe this Chapter is the gateway to understanding the Bible.
Where I wish you to focus on is versus 15 & 20. 20 in turn is referencing Mathew 10:24 and John 13:16. Just think on that for a few days and let the weight of it sink in.

2 Corinthians 1:24 (Paul)

2 Corinthians 10:12-18 (Paul)

1 Peter 5 (Peter)

There are many others that I could list but I believe that you can find them yourself by cross referencing the ones I listed. Truly, the Bible touches on this topic A LOT. Basics: We are all equal, no one can elevate themselves over another, and if they do, then God will punish them severely. 

We are suppose to take a few steps to help them out though. Sometimes we sin without knowing it and it takes another person to tell us so.  You can find the instructions at: Mathew 18: 15-17

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“I haven't had any experience or exposure to someone with autism….They are giving Satan way too much credit.”

I cannot tell you how many Reverends would hate you right now because that is, more or less, what I tell the those who say Autism is Demonic. Granted, some of those say God will save anyone, including those with Autism. But they treat it like a Person will be “cured” of Autism upon accepting the savior. Sadly, that is just fully misguided, in my opinion, because there is no promise of us being healed in this lifetime. It’s similar to saying a Blind/Deaf person will be healed when saved and casting them out of a church when they are not.

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“No disrespect and I'm…. wholeheartedly when he finds it.”

I understand you. However, I think that you let me being a “Philosopher” mislead you to what I am. People are kinder to a Philosopher because they see someone practical who Thinks and Knows. There’s a reason I do not flaunt out my true believes because as Jesus best put it: “Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.” (Matthew 7:6).  People will automatically close you out if they even think that you belief in something that is perceptively against their own. For this reason I approach people with an open mind so that they give me the same courtesy. However, if they will not hear me or see what I have to give then it is best for me to leave them alone. They are close-minded.

On terms of Philosophy alone, the exact meaning is “Lover of Wisdom”. The Philosophers’ creed is to seek the truth and find it and cherish it. However, many people, including philosophers, get stuck on knowledge and argue and debate things of factual basis only with no intent to learn or understand it. The point of debates is to gain knowledge and use correctly to gain wisdom by doing the right thing. However, not everything that is said or spoken is truth, but a wise man “But he who is spiritual appraises all things, yet he himself is appraised by no one. For WHO HAS KNOWN THE MIND OF THE LORD, THAT HE WILL INSTRUCT HIM? For we have the mind of Christ” (1 Corinthians 2:15-16).

This is why Aristotle’s quote is my favorite Philosophy quote:  “A mark of an educated man [or woman] is one who can entertain a notion without necessarily accepting it”.  It’s basically saying that a smart man will listen but not necessarily be swayed. Because that man has to weigh the truth behind what is being said. If it’s true, he accepts it. If not, then he will not.

However, you are correct on not being swayed by human’s  Philosophies and empty arguments. As this warning does appear in the bible, “See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, according to the tradition of men, according to the elementary principles of the world, rather than according to Christ” (Colossians 2:8). This includes theology (the bane to true wisdom from God is to force his knowledge to be human).
 
The Bible instructs us on 2 specific ways to instantly know if we are facing a deceptive person ruled by the world.  I’ll leave it to you to find them.

Also, I belief you meant to say, “…start with the book of [Matthew]” since that is the first Gospel in most Bibles.  I am actually very well versed in the Bible, more so then most “reverends”, and own (and read) more than 45 different versions and Translations. Though, I will not claim to know all of it. I regularly study the Bible to see if I missed anything or to gain new insight. You are more than welcome to PM me if you want to know my personal beliefs and my reasons for pursuing the 8 Fold Path and Book of Mormon, along with other religious texts.

WandererExiled :

This actually is a large advance on what my mind was subconsciously churning. The greek "δαίμων" is the "demon" of english, and used as agathodaimōn and kakós because it is an umbrella term for "spirit". What is quite notable from Nicomachean Ethics is "εὐδαιμονία", eudiamonia, or "flourishment". This is the same greek root word, diamon. Literally, according to this interpretation, Aristotle's ethics tells us to strive for the spirit of peace. This is quite an easy transition into Christian ethics from Aristotelian ethics. Evil demons plague our lives, but our striving for virtue is our sole source for eudiamonia. All that is left is to assert the metaphysical depravity of the human diamon (and actually, many secular Aristotle critics say that eudiamonia is an impossible goal). From the understanding of real depravity, we must rely on a Χριστός (Savior).

I think that this is could turn into a lovely college paper. Race you to it

For some ethos, I'm getting my masters in Philosophy now and have been a Christian (conservative Lutheran) since I was 8 days old. I study philosophy and theology for fun and work. My undergrad was entirely in Aristotle and Thomas Aquinas, my Masters has been a concentration in ethics, but spread over non-naturalism, Leibniz, and Spinoza. From this perspective, I compliment you on your understanding of Aristotle.

Txgangsta :

Thank you. I am actually a self-learned Philosopher. I came across it when studying the history of Greece (History to me is like Philosophy to you). I start with Aristotle since, as mentioned before,  he was Alexander's teacher, and at that time, I wanted to get inside Alexander's mind and try to understand his reasoning.

I studied Psychology (with a concentration in Social Work), and a minor in Occupational Therapy. However, I had to drop out before obtain my B.S. Because of lack of funds. I won't be attending college anytime soon so you'll definitely will beat me to it lol!

According to my 'limited' understanding of eudemonia, it can be achieved and has been by several people. However, it can be impossible to most people. In Psychology, as I mentioned in my last post, this would be "Self-transcendence".

The  way I can think of to put this in general terms is by this example:

Image living in a brand new house. Yet there is, unknown to you, a very invasive vinous plant that has seeded under your wall. When it starts to Grow, you fight vigorously to keep it back, but because you don't know where its roots are, you can never get rid of it. Eventually, you realize that this is "impossible" so you move to just repairing the damages. That too after a while gets tiring so you give up and just let it tear into the house.

Now, this man, who knows about this plant and how to get to the root, tells you that you have to tear down the entire house, dig deep into the foundations and pull it out.  It sounds simple enough, but you realize that this requires sacrificing all your money, time, and sweat you put into the house. It has to be destroyed!

Now most people stop here and tell the man off and deal with the uphill, and losing, battle with just putting up with it. A good number, though, accept the man's offer and they tear down a part of the house (the part where the vine is doing the most damage), but they wonder why they can't find the roots still. A few actually go out and tear down the whole house but soon get distracted by other things (like rebuilding off of the foundation). <-[this is Buddhist in my opinion, they sacrifice a lot if not all but they can't go on from there]

A very select few actually go the whole nine yards and do everything. They destroy the house, they dig up the roots and painstakingly get every little speck of the plant (with the help of the man's guidance), and they begging to build a larger house off a new foundation. <[-this group is like Mother Teresa and other people who figure out that "true" unconditional love is the answer].

The last group had went all the way down to Physiological level of self, fighting to survive and from that point on they slowly built themselves back up, but focusing on others the entire while and watching out for "roots of evil". Eventually, they reach such a level of self, and peace, that they can hep others do the same. The key is to literally let go of everything -- physical, emotional, social, and spiritual and to actively rebuild on the correct foundation. That is impossible if someone doesn't/can't get past a certain personal issue.

I am sorry if this seems like a bunch of gibberish, I am working off of no sleep for 1 1/2 days, I need sleep XD!

I think, though, that I should probably make another thread that;s dedicated to Spiritual Philosophy and all that stuff, when I wake up.  I'm pretty sure we both could go on forever, going from one topic to another.

WandererExiled :

You're understanding of eudiamonia seems to simply be an improvement on Freud, haha. That's not what I gather at all from the original Nicomachean Ethics. Aristotle seems to have a loved for order. Physical objects obey an order, metaphysical objects obey an order, and "good" action is orderly behavior. However, "virtue" isn't simply doing that good action. Instead Aristotle demands that there be a state of order within you constantly (habit). Therefore, you're not a virtuous person just because you did one good thing one time. You're only "virtuous" when you have a habit of doing the right thing, or where you've self-imposed an instinct to do what is right. This is his eudiamonia. You're well-ordered down to the bone. This is the synthesis into your mysticism.

But to stay on topic, the eudiamonia (literally means "good spirit")  is not just well-ordered behavior or well-ordered life, but to be well-ordered yourself. Mental illnesses would (more than likely) conflict with this goal of eudiamonia, and therefore a mental illness is a "bad spirit". It is easy to now call them "demons" without invoking some superstitious oogabooga. Quite simply, all it means is that they're disordered.

WandererExiled : I have Asperger's Syndrome, an Autism Spectrum Disorder.  I also have Schizophrenia.  Did demons cause my Asperger's Syndrome?  I don't know.  It may be the work of demons, much like Job's trials were the work of Satan.  Perhaps my condition is God allowing Satan to affect me in order to test and prove me.  I do, however; fully believe my Schizophrenia is the work of demons.  Often there will be "voices in my head" that will tell me to do things I am against.  Sometimes those things very much seem to be removed from my experiences and cannot simply be attributed to a simple mental disorder.  Surely my mental state contributes to the voices, but I truly believe evil spirits are seeking to influence me through this.  It has been very trying sometimes to ignore those voices and move on.  If it were not for my faith in Christ, I'd be angry, confused, and lost.  I still don't know everything, although I know I'm on the right path, and struggle to correct myself at times.  In short, although these things may be the work of demons, I am not a demon.  I am a child of God, and hope others will see me as such.

P.S.  The Book of Mormon?  Great book.  You'll love it (I hope!)

Txgangsta :

That's about what I was trying to get at. One, who is disordered down to the born, have to deconstruct completely (down to the soul level) in order to build up in good order. It's not something to be done overnight but in many years --if not a lifetime! lol but yea I took the psychology approach since that's my forte. I'll be summoning you to another thread so we can have an "On-topic discussion" and still continue to talk philosophy.

supernerd117 :

Yea, it seems Christians nowadays are quick to call others demons due to everyday mental issues, when what it really needs is love, prayer, and fasting (Directly related to demons: Matthew 17:14-21, Mark 9:14-29, Luke 9:37-42; related to the power of pray and fasting: Isaiah 58:1–12, Mosiah 27:22–23, Helaman 3:35, Alma 17:3). I assumed you were Mormon so I added those passages in there too.

You are the 4th Autistic person I know on this site now, but I would have never guessed you to have Schizophrenia. Just goes to show us ignorant folk that we hardly know who we are talking to and the issues they could be having. We need to be more Mindful of these things and do our best to help each other out and build up one another (the reverse causes suicides ).

fearlessjazp567 :

Sorry about the delay! I think you might be talking about this latest news piece. Apparently both are being allowed to bond out by Judge William Bennett. I'll go ahead and put on record that I do not like Judge Bennett, I met and talked to him and I think he is one the most twisted and corrupted judges in Louisiana. He'll talk about "evidence" but he has put more people on death row for execution on little to no evidence than the other way around. Bonus to this: Among all the Police shootings of Black folks on the news (they'll focus on the white officers but quite a few had black officers involved), this incident is reversed --Black Officers shooting and killing white folks.  Also Derrick Stafford was arrested before on 2 counts aggravated rape (which this Officer is looking towards a possible Life in Prison on similar charges).

More info on this Wikipedia page.

I think everyone should be treated fairly and have their rights upheld. Otherwise, why would we even need or have a legal system. I feel that a good number of cops --like certain State and Federal government officials-- think they are above the law.

If I hit you in the head with a hammer and you are little slow afterwards, its just because my mighty hammer put a demon in you. No lie.

Once upon a time, epilepsy was believed to be someone possessed by demons, and the best way to cure it was... Holy Water. Now modern science knows that it is a neurological problem and treats it accordingly.

So unless you can bring substantial proof (as in, using the scientific method) of your claims, then they hold no solid ground.

I am an agnostic.

janus :

I like your response. Maybe you'll find it just as interesting as me when you see that before Holy Water it was Prayer and Fasting (Mark 9:17-29).  No how it went from Praying and self starvation to Holy Water, beats me.

XD but thanks for reminding me of that. Now the next time a Christian says "You/he/she has a Demon", I'm going to respond with, "Then pray and starve yourself for me/him/her!"