When a user of the board is accused of flamming or spamming or duplicate accounts,  what do you think should decide on rather they are perma banned or just banned?

I think a user of the board should be regular(short term) banned for spamming, as well as for flamming(without swearing), and duplicate accounts depending on how many they made, and should only be perma banned for harassment(constant harassment with swearing at members)as well as spamming after the user has been warned ample times, but I also think the accused should at least have the "right" to know and confront their accuser.  Also I think  the age of the user should have an affect on the matter also of if the deserve perma banned or banned.

Vizzed community what are your thoughts about what should  decide if a user is either perma banned or short term banned?

marcushoward : i agree with you on everything but i have one more thing to say , can peop.e get perma banned based on how big the spam is , for example : if the spam is 1000 words long or over .

supercool22 : To be honest I don't really know, but I think that could have something to do with how long the ban is for.

When it comes to spamming I think mild spam should be a regular ban.
If the spam is excessive then I think that is justification for a perma ban.

Flamming however is more brutal, I think its fine to stand up for yourself in certain situations. But not launch a full on attack at someone calling them every name under the sun (not accusing anyone here just stating my thoughts)
So to this effect I think an assault with flamming on a huge scale should be perma banned, little digs at people that do no major harm are fine in my eyes. As long as it isn't below the line, and as long as it is for defending yourself.

Multiple accounts on the other hand, I think should be a straight forward perma ban myself, be it one account or many the user is cheating the system to gain more Viz.
And anyone who has read the rules should know the consequences if they do this. So on that I think perma banning for multiple accounts is perfectly acceptable.

Well that's my thoughts on it, thou I have no argument as to how the rules are right now.

Since I was personally asked for an opinion on this topic:

As far a the procedure for discipline in the case of flaming or spamming..... it pretty much is done the way you suggest already.  Warnings are generally issued, and if the bad behavior continues, temporary bans are issued.  Continued refusal to change usually results in a perma ban, although this is after several instances.  Of course, if the flaming or spamming is extreme, the person might just outright be perma banned.

As for age... it's a little difficult to take it into consideration.  Like ender44 said... a 10 year old harassing is the same as a 30 year old harassing.... and many users lie about their age.  Thus, giving leeway to an account that shows up as '10' years old might actually be giving leeway to a fully capable adult. That being said, I do know age is often taken into consideration when bans are placed.  Sometimes a younger kid shows that he or she is willing to learn, and sometimes it's a bit obvious that another kid simply isn't willing to take advice.  Thus, all of this stuff being taken into consideration is really on a case by case basis.

Confronting an accuser, I agree, is important.  However, many of the users flaming or spamming do not have the maturity to do so... thus, it's really evidence that ends up being the final decider.  I mean, the mods aren't going to ban someone because someone else accused them of something.  The matters are always investigated, and hard core evidence is used to make a decision on who was in the wrong.

Thus, I'm not really sure the proposed... changes?.... would really affect anything.  I think that in MOST cases, the mods try to make balanced and fair decisions.  Nobody is perfect and sometimes bad choices are made.... but we're all human, and forgiveness and a willingness to learn are key.

Yep I pretty much agree with what you said. I personaly don't know alot about the matter concerning being banned.. except for flaming and spamming.

I'm only going to answer from the question you asked.  "What should decide...?"
The rules set by the global and local mods should decide. 
Oh, and one thing that really bothers me.
"Also I think  the age of the user should have an affect on the matter also of if the deserve perma banned or banned."
No.  Just no.  If you really are 10 and spam, you should learn not to spam.  Age doesn't matter at all when it comes to the ability to be a quality member.  I fail to see how age could possibly have an effect on punishment given.

mlb789 : pretty much!

The only difference I find that age makes is how quickly I ban someone. If someone is 10 I usually give them a bit longer to figure things out and learn than I give someone who is 20. A 20 year old should know better by now. The internet is not new anymore. Internet etiquette is well known by now so the 20 year old should know how to act. The 10 year old wouldn't have as much experience on the internet though.

That doesn't mean they won't get banned but I'm willing to let it slide just a little bit longer.

geeogree : Of course, you have to keep in mind that I'm kind of biased against the age thing, since I see some users that use the young stereotype for their advantage or to justify someone doing something stupid.  That just makes me mad, seeing that I am one of the "younger" (14U) users, and I fail to see the point in doing any of that.

But of course, if it's like a 5 year old, that's totally different, but when you hit about 8-9, you should know what to do/not to do on the internet by then.

mlb789 : I think you are over-estimating what the average user is like. When you are the exception to the rule you quite often don't understand or relate well to the average user.

mlb789 : Shed some light on something for me, do all users have to abide by the rules of the board, if so how come pacman1755 has two profiles?

geeogree :   When there is an exception to the rule that means that it is possible to make the exception the new rule.
Edit:  Marcus, if you read the names, it says pacman1755 (old) and pacman1755.  That means that something had to happen to the old account for the new one to be allowed.  Only David has the power to change names like that.

marcushoward : one of his accounts was hacked, so he got a new one.

ender44 : Now answer me this if it was hacked, why is it still active and usable?Why hasen't it been perma banned or banned?mlb789


mlb789

marcushoward : most of the higher up staff, both past and present, have 2 or more accounts. Quite often this is so we can do some testing on a feature for David via a lower power-level. That's why we don't ban those extra accounts. They have their uses.

Plus, we don't go around the board searching out duplicate accounts. If we notice something strange about someone we investigate but we don't have a staff member who checks profiles all day or anything.

marcushoward : Perma-banning an account bans the IP as well (I believe).  Thus, he would be unable to access vizzed.  If you have a rereg account and it is known, as long as you don't get on and use it it won't be banned.  This is such a case.
Also, you failed your summons on me.  You have to do it at the beginning of a sentence with a colon or it doesn't work.

marcushoward : Well if i were to say so. I agree with most things you say but a few expections i would make. I would probably Perma banned a User Like lets say he keeps on Spamming or flaming Staff  over and over again.  Too many dupe accounts Should sound fair. Sandwhich posting is fair too considering thats someone who wont let anyone respond to their post or anything. So yea thats my thoughts 

marcushoward : We do take all of these things into consideration. What you have to understand is that even to get a short term ban most of these users have had at least a few warnings. We do not go around just banning people for fun.

We are a patient group and we for sure take into account younger users. The problem is that a lot of times they don't "get it" even after repeated warnings or patience from staff trying to show them the correct way.

All bans and abuse are reviewed by the moderation team and everyone has the chance to weigh in. The only times when people are perma-banned is when either A. They ask for it, or B. They have REPEATEDLY broken the rules even after being banned or warned. They have all gotten more chances than they probably should.

Also I'm not sure what you mean by "Facing their accuser" anything that has happened to get them banned they know full well about because any of the mods PM them directly. It's not like it's some huge secret. They know.