JigSaw :

I never said for Vizzed as a whole.

I don't think I ever told you the story of how I came to Vizzed.

I found Vizzed looking for a game (that didn't even exist no less... whoops). I stumbled across the RGR, and thought... this couldn't hurt.

So I signed up to play games. I didn't even touch the forum (or the rest of the site by extension) until a little later.

Had I been required to donate I wouldn't have gone to the forum. I would have just left and went to another site. And that would have been that.

The reason I'm on the forum now, is because the RGR hooked me then.

I have the basically the same story for how I joined Vizzed as leggy. I barely felt safe downloading something from this site. I don't know that I would've even given the game room a chance if I had to pay. And without the game room to grab me in, I would've never come to the forums or the chat room. But something really should be done. Maybe make it free for a limited time and then force users to pay. Maybe allow them to pay with Viz (a lot of Viz) and give the currency some worth, and a way for users to get the plugin if they've contributed a lot to the site.

Those aren't well thought out ideas, but they are ideas. The plugin really is incredible and even though I never use it anymore, I agree with JigSaw when he says that tom deserves more than he's getting.

soxfan849 :

I don't mind the Viz being an option. That's fine. It'd give Viz more worth for once, and I wouldn't be shoveling it away for the sake of giving it away.

I don't think real life money is the option. You'll lose a large portion of users I feel if you have to pay real money for the plugin. (I know I wouldn't use the RGR in that case. I don't have ANY money to spare, and I'm sure several people have the same story I do. Especially given the type of people this site draws.)

My parents look down on this site, and I'm sure several parents wouldn't be gung ho about paying for their child to use games on site. They'd probably just tell the kid to find a site that's free.

legacyme3 : I'm not even here for games and I donated multiple times. If I can donate to something I don't even use then people who use it surely can donate.

The gaming industry makes billions a year, so for people to not have money for games and who are gamers themselves is hard to believe. Its an addiction and I know people will pay anything to get their hands on something they love. No other site has a plugin as good as this its one of the reasons why its so popular and innovative.

Without the plugin, where would vizzed rgr be? The RGR wouldn't have gotten as far as it did without it cause it is basically the heart of playing n64 and gba in your browser without having to set it all up on your desktop. Sure vizzed rgr would still be popular but not as popular without the plugin.

If people can't pay then fine, they can go use another site with crappy or no plugins that never get updated or just download and play them the old fashioned way by downloading the roms and emulators. People who dont have money could pay with Viz too.

A one time download fee for the newest plugin won't hurt and its not like it would be $500, it would be a few bucks and would last forever until new updates are made.

JigSaw :

The big question here is, do you have more than 5 cents to your name?

If the answer is yes, you have more money than I do.

I have just enough money to keep my bank account open. No one will hire me, so I can't get a job to get more money to fill up that bank account with money I could eventually use to donate.

I would love to donate, but I physically cannot. I have no income, and I'm in debt as it is.

I'm not saying the plugin isn't repsonsible for bringing a lot of people here. But charging for it will chase a lot of people away. The game room has the most activity of any part of the site.

And even a few bucks is too much for someone who has no bucks to their name. I'd rather not detest the very reason I came to the site in the first place.

JigSaw :


I hear ya.  At least the development can be fun to, but it can also be tedious and boring at times.  I'm just in a fragile place right now where too dang irritable and to come on here saying basically "i wrote you the plugin you play games on, don't have money for groceries, borrowing even $10 would help me out a lot, I can pay back very soon in addition to whatever 20+% interest you want, and get like nobody showing interest.... pisses me off   

So nice of soxfan849 to offer to donate... maybe will luck out and he didn't leave for work yet.  Kind of funny and sad, but getting an energy drink or two actually does help my day out a lot.  At least though $10 is enough for a few, so I can make a walk to the grocery store more worth while.

Totally understand though related to people that just don't have money.  No hard feelings there.  In your case especially hearing you donated as much as you did in the past, that really amazes me.  I lost my passion for video games years ago, but it's still cool seeing a lot of guys like you on here that are passionate in that area.  Especially like you and David that actually invested a lot of personal income into the project/site.

As for charging though, that sounds risky due to the nature of the site.  At least with most the games being so old, hopefully nobody cares about the related copyright issues (not even sure how they work w/ really old games).  If money starts being charged tho, that seems like it could change things and maybe cause issues for David and the site.

I would have no problem donating had I not donated $100 to vizzed on 4/27/12, maybe that's where David was going to have $100+ for tip money.

legacyme3 :


Sorry to hear you're poor like me.  I have maybe like $0.50 in pennies (used all my silver change) and like 35 cents in my checking account + maybe like 10-20 cents in my paypal.

Like I just mentioned in my previous e-mail, no hard feelings even in the slightest toward people who just can't afford it.  I wish you luck finding work.

tRIUNE :


Looks like you fall into that catagory to with JigSaw and David where it's cool you invested significant personal income... impressive.

No problem if you can't afford it.  Like I mentioned in this thread though, I wasn't even looking for donations (though I will accept them)... just a small loan (even $5 would help my day significantly) where I'll pay back a lot of interest very shortly (should be less than a week).... so it's a chance to make money + help me out.

tom760 :

Yeah it sucks, in my case, it's just that people don't want to hire a guy with no work experience (aside from working for a forum.) which is just a pain in the ass to deal with.

I think right now... I have... the minimum in my bank account (which cannot be withdrawn), a quarter in my wallet, and a few pennies on my desk.

Hopefully I do get a job of sorts soon, I've always felt bad about not being able to give back in some way to the site.

JigSaw :


Like I said (and David has expressed the same concerns as well to me), I worry a lot about requiring any fees causing legal issues for David.  Things are already totally in a scary grey zone in that regard that I'm not sure what to think about.

At least it's a cool style reporting on the site total costs involved for the site + total donations.  As long as nobody is profiting much from the site, it seems maybe a radically lower risk catagory to be in than actually requiring payments and making a lot of money.

tom760 : If we can get the plugin issues fixed and go live tonight, that's just in time for the weekend which is when we get the most traffic. As I said, I'll announce the plugin and ask people to donate to your paypal address and post your paypal address. You should no doubt get donations right away and get a good amount of donations throughout the weekend. It's just a matter of you getting it ready tonight and making it a priority so that you can get your money. I honestly only have like $8 in my paypal right now, if it'll help you out I can send that now. I'm currently working on selling some stuff, I should be able to come up with some money soon though. I'm hoping the donations from the plugin going live will be way more than enough to help you out for a while though.

legacyme3 :


What kind of work would you be looking for?

tom760 :

Anything I can handle really. The only thing I have to turn down is HARD physical labor (such as construction), or anything that would do a heavy number on my back. I have a bad back.

Ideally I'll get to do something in the lines of clerk work, or standing at a counter. That stuff is easy enough and requires only very basic training.

(long story short, I just have nothing going for me, and need a job that almost anyone can do.)

I decided I could send some cash. I wouldn't expect interest for it.

tom760 :

Glad to see you got it. Like I told you, don't worry about ever paying me back.

And I'll add you to Windows Live at some point, but I don't have any real questions right now. I'll add you as soon as I have any legitimate questions (do let me know if they're a bit much, though, I don't want to waste your time). Although if you have any good references for learning Python, PHP, MySQL or any of that I'd appreciate it.

And I didn't even think about the legal issues. That is a pretty massive flaw in the idea of charging people for the plugin...

tRIUNE :


I got a $20 paypal from someone, I'm guess that's you?  Very appreciative of the borrowing money.  Anyways, David was able to pay me $50 last night, so I just paypal'd the $20 back to whoever it was that sent it. 

Yeah, the 20 was from me.

soxfan849 :


Np, just send me a msg whenever it feels right.
I don't know any specific sites to recommend for learning that stuff.  Should be really easy to search Google for some.  A quick search led me to these URL's which you might find useful.

Python: http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/5-websites-learn-python-programming/
PHP: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/2228013/which-is-the-best-site-for-learning-more-on-php
MySql: http://www.frihost.com/forums/vt-103008.html

What I remember with me though learning programming was doing too much on my own and having learning certain concepts take a long time to grasp.  If you get started learning and run into any stuff where it's confusing and you're not getting it, I would be totaly happy to see if I can answer questions to speed you along.  Same goes with if you run into challenges setting up development or server software.

I assume you use Windows?  What version?  Also not sure how much you care about setting up a local webserver + mysql environment.  Maybe you have a webhost you planned to use for all your development and testing.

You could setup a local environment where you can learn without any need for buying webhosting though.

I'm most familiar with Microsoft's IIS webserver, which may or may not be available for your version of Windows.  I would recommend doing a google search for "IIS install windows ".  You should find out really quick if that's an option for you.  If it is, I would use that for a server.  Also, if you go with IIS, it looks like this webpage would likely be what you want to download + install in order to get PHP support added to Microsofts webserver: http://php.iis.net/

If IIS isn't supported on your version of Windows, I'm not sure what your best option would be.  Might be to use a Windows version of the Apache webserver.

I think these would be the links you would want for downloading Python and MySql for Windows:

MySql:  http://dev.mysql.com/downloads/mysql/
Python:  http://www.activestate.com/activepython/downloads