So, I went to see a specialist a few days ago about my herniated disc, and he pretty much told me that the MRI I provided him was lying, the X-RAYS were lying, and my 1 to 2 cigarettes a week were the cause of my back pain and pain in left leg, not the nerve that is pinched ( according to him, it is just being slightly touched and agitated ) He also refused to operate on me since I am only 20, so, I have to have a procedure to insert steroids into my back where the herniated disc is at. So, that means that I will be put to sleep while they do it. If, and only if, the procedure doesn't work, will he ever consider allowing me to be operated on. 

Now, I don't know how long it will take, so I will not entirely active on Tuesday, but I just thought my friends would like to know what is going on with my back. 

Time for the summons. 

alexanyways :
Arctic Wolf (SS82) :
Cyro Xero :
Jordanv78 :
Laian :
pacman1755 :
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YourMajestyKen :
beautiful nightmare :
Frodlex :
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SunflowerGaming : 
PacmanandMariofan : 
MattyIce : 
TheFadedWarrior : 
Eniitan : 
tRIUNE : 
cooldragon1990 :
McDavideo7s :
Fireproof :
Juliet :
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mrfe :
sonicmcmuffin :
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Yngwie : 
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tgags123 : 
megamanmaniac : 

Wow dude, sounds serious. I didn't know smoking 1-2 cigarettes a week could cause problems like that (kinda being sarcastic since I think that is a false diagnosis from the doctor).

I also didn't know about this until just now. I hope all goes well.

They will do that I'm afraid, They'll try to blame it on smaller things and will say that your just exaggerating or lying... It's too essentially save money, etc..

Keep in mind that they also do take into consideration your health... It's much healthier to get some steroid injections than it is to have surgery and its less likely to cause damage as well.

tRIUNE : I was already diagnosed. I went to the specialist to see about surgery. He basically said that all my previous tests, including the ones from when I was in the Army were a complete lie. 

thing1 : I have a question, what did he mean by, the MRI and xrays are lying..... I don't understand what he meant by that. Was he saying that nothing was showing up or???

How do steroids help something like that?  And how confident do you feel with this doctor?  The two different 'sources' of your pain seem to be too different for comfort, honestly.  The doctors having such different ideas is kind of scary.  I hope this helps and I pray that you will be kept in safe health.

SunflowerGaming : I guess the best way to put it is that he tried to tell me that the MRI and X-RAY weren't as bad as they looked. 

Singelli : Not very. After I have my procedure on Tuesday, if I am feeling good enough, I will call my doctor, and make an appointment. He wanted an update anyways. I will ask if he can recommend me to another specialist for a 2nd opinion if my ObamaCare will cover it, since the VA still has not gotten back to me about an appointment. 

thing1 : So is there any damage at all and he's just saying it's not as bad as it's making you feel?

SunflowerGaming : I have a herniated disc, Degenerative Disc Disease, and Kyphosis.... it's why I got out of the Army. The guy is just scared and feeding me a bunch of bull because I am 20 and he is scared to operate on me. 

Steroids... I have to agree with Singelli about this. I'm really worried. I understand you are not really confident as well. I would feel the same to be honest. You know why I'm worried? Because I know how incompetent a person can be. And I'm talking about personal experience when I mean "incompetence" because I've seen lot of unacceptable things. Things that made me upset and did feed my frustration and my willpower. But that's besides the point. I'll eventually talk about that later. I also know how they react afterwards. The typical speech to avoid troubles if it didn't go well: they either say it's your fault or it was an accident. I don't want to scare you. I just hope they know what they really do. And most important, what's best for you.

thing1 : I just want to say that my Dad is leaving the hospital and has been in the hospital 2 full days (48 hours). He is being released soon (getting ready to go pick him up). He had what looked like a stroke but some doctors (We had maybe 20 or more doctors visit) believe this to be migraines and mini-stroke. They took MRA, Ultra Sound of the Heart, Checked his Neck, Checked the Arteries, Did other stuff and gave him medicine for the migraines. His X-Rays and MRA and everything showed nothing wrong at all. As soon as he saw the Neurologist (Indian guy with no decent quality of English (Pardon any sounding racism)) he told my dad he can go home and that he's better now. He will prescribe a pill that will take away the migraine.

The purpose of me sharing this is what we're doing next. We're going to get a second opinion on this because we don't feel secure with this other, what seems to be lazy, doctor. Some doctors are incompetent, stupid and lazy despite their multiple college level degrees. Your life is not a toy to be played with. If you feel as I do, get another opinion from another specialist to be on the safe side. If another doctor agrees, then maybe this Steriods to the back thing might work. To me, it sounds like they just dont want to do their job. Of course, it could be that there are many complications that can occur, especially since it sounds like spinal surgery.

*** Nobody needs to reply to my post and talk about my Dad and his hospital stay, this is not the right thread for this***

Last thing I wanna say... My parents smoke 1-3 packs of cigarettes a day. You smoke 1-2 cigarettes a week. My girlfriend smokes a pack a week. Your 1-2 cigarettes is not the underlying cause for the pinched nerve in your back, I don't even know if that is possible. It probably isn't possible. Some Doctors like to blame cigarettes for everything. Do what you feel is right and if you trust this specialist, good luck. I don't generally trust doctors all too well.

Oh, man. That's probably pretty scary for you. I hope your procedure goes well and that you'll let us know everything we want to know about it.

thing1 : Singelli: I'm a family doc, and I know you have no reason to believe me on this but there's a few people on this board, like Singelli in this thread, that could probably avouch this for me, but I'll try to clarify all this. 

The concept with the imaging is not that they are "lying". There have been multiple studies and meta-analyses that have shown there is no correlation between MRI findings and degree pain with disc herniations. Meaning, you could have a sever bilateral herniation, or a vertebral disc that is almost non-existent and only have mild to no pain, or have minimal MRI findings and have crippling pain. 

On top of all that, the success rate of improving pain after disc herniations is not statistically significant. This means that if you take a sample of a random group of people and retroactively assess their pain, there is not a measurable difference between the people who have improved pain vs no change in pain vs worsening pain. There is always the risk of paralysis with back surgery as well, because the goal of the surgery is to excise the vertebral disk that is compressing a nerve that is controlling sensory and motor function for parts of the body below that level.

In order, the most effective treatments/therapies for chronic back pain are physical therapy, steroid injections, and surgery, in that order. Physical therapy will re-strengthen parts of your core to take the strain off your back and relieve the spasms that are irritating the nerves, to relieve pain. (IE by strengthening your abdominal muscles, you correct the force vectors from pulling on your back to evenly distribute all the stress you back would be dealing with.)

The steroid injections the doc is referring to are not the steroids that people think of with body builders or the ones that were/are abused in major league baseball. Those are called anabolic steroids, and physiologically work completely differently. The therapeutic injections are corticosteroids. These work to inhibit the inflammatory response around the affected area. The body carries all its healing factors, etc... in the blood, and to heal an area, all this excess fluid gets sent to the injured area due to signals released by the area. With all this extra fluid, comes extra pressure that pushes on all the structures in the area, including the nerves that cause your sensation of pain, causing a vicious cycle of pain, and swelling/irritation. By giving a corticosteroid, this inhibits the cycle to take the irritation away from the nerve to help the pain. This is used all the time, people get these injections in knees and elbows all the time to fix the pain.

So keep all this in mind when you're talking to the specialists. Sure, they may not have great bedside manner and may not explain in detail everything I just attempted to, but there's a process we all follow to decide what will most benefit the patient. If you don't agree with us, you absolutely have the right to at least ask a billion questions or to seek a second opinion. If you can't feel like you can't trust your doctor, you should absolutely find somebody else, because at it's core, the patient-physician relationship is the most crucial thing.

If there is something else I can help clarify, please let me know. Hope this is at least somewhat helpful.

mikez913 : This was pretty much the point i was trying to make. Surgery is always a last resort.. Especially when it comes to the spine

thing1 : Just let me know if you need me to work the football pool. If you think you might be out Tuesday, I can make the HOF thread if you want. Just let me know.

As far as your procedure goes, and the specialist you're seeing, I don't understanding why he's scared to operate on you because of your age. And what causes X-rays and MRIs to lie? I mean, I don't know the first thing about the medical industry, but that just doesn't make any sense to me. In my opinion, and I don't wanna scare you, it sounds like you're probably have to be operated on. But then again, what would I know...

mikez913 : I knew that there was another word in front of "steroids", but I could not remember what it was. 

I have done physical therapy... twice! I did it while in the Army, and that just made it worse. I did it again when I had to restart the entire process after getting out of the Army, and all they did was give me electrical stimulation and a hot tub... Didn't do any good either. I got as far as the surgery consultation when I was in the Army, and they wanted to operate on my immediately, but I could not get the surgery because I was getting out 2 weeks later. 

The specialist that I saw said that they would pretty much just remove they herniated part of the disc if I ended up needed surgery, to relieve pressure on the nerve. I'm fine with that. I want the pain in my back to go away, and especially the pain behind my left knee. 

I have accepted the chance of being paralyzed. The way I see it is this: if it happens, it happens. If it does not happen, then it does not happen. But, if I were to be paralyzed, it would only help my VA claim, and my disability rating would skyrocket. While that may not be a good reason, I am trying to stay on the bright side. 

One thing that I am worried about with this procedure though is that when I get it, will I still be able to donate a kidney to my sister in about 2-10 years if she needs it, due to the steroids. I tried doing some research, but I was unable to find anything. A few people in chat even tried helping me, but they could not find anything either. 

sonicmcmuffin : Oh, I know it's a last resort. I just believe that I should have had it a year ago when the specialist I saw in Hawai'i while I was in the Army wanted to operate on me. 

PacmanandMariofan : Yeah, I will make another thread with an update. I know a lot of people want to know what is going on with my back, and actually care about me, at least in this sense. 

Fireproof : My doctor wanted an update, so I plan on calling and making an appointment on Tuesday after the procedure, if I am feeling up to it. I will also be asking for a referral for a 2nd opinion, as long as my insurance will cover that.  

And too bad about your Dad. I know what he going through in terms of being jerked by the Doctors. 

Laian : I am willing to give it a try, but I still know that I will ultimately need surgery. 

That is quite scary... They're going to really use steroids? And 1-2 cigarettes a week can cause this kind of problem? Well, I'm certainly no doctor and but it just sounds... Weird.

But good luck on your procedure though. Hope everything turns out well. 

thing1 : Have you thought about getting a second opinion?

SunflowerGaming : I am going to make an appointment after my procedure on Tuesday with my Doctor to give him an update, and to ask for a referral for a 2nd opinion. 

mohammedroxx3 : Well, read what the doc said. He described it better than I did. And yeah... he pretty was feeding me crap because he does not want to operate on me since I am so young. 

I'm glad you're keeping on the bright side of things. It's not easy to do when it feels like so much is piled against you.  I'll be praying for a safe recovery no matter what method of healing you go through.  All of them can't be easy, even though some are easier than others.