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How literally do you believe in the Bible?

 

08-02-12 02:53 PM
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I have not ever been a very religious guy, and since I started browsing the kind of pro atheist site called Reddit, my faith in a Christian God has dropped far below 50%. 

Since there are so many versions and translations of the Bible and the canon has been changed many times, I never believed that the Bible is directly made of Gods words unlike I know some do. Instead I believe that its written by pretty normal people and has their individual perspectives and ideas, and that the Bible is meant to lead people in the right direction, instead of giving answers to every question.  This has led me to take a very relativistic view of the bible.
Like I have always believed in evolution and such, so when I red the story of creation, I believed that the writer either meant that 1. Its just a one way to describe that God is omnipotent or 2. Its his personal theory of creation, and it became popular because back then people did know better. 
Also I think that the laws and rules written in the bible were more like guides and are subject to change over time, and thus should not be directly applied today. Like when Jesus says that we should sell everything that we have and give it to the poor, it should be red as "you should not try to achieve unnecessary riches, when you could use that wealth to help others." I still agree very much with this moral, like I do with pretty much everything Jesus said, especially what he said about forgiveness.

I know that there are thousands if not millions of fundamentalist Christians who claim to believe everything said in the Bible and obey all of its teachings still today. But I don't actually think that there is a single Christian who does all that. Like how many people you guys have heard tearing out their right eye because it did sin. Does anyone still believe that if a virgin girl gets raped, she should be forced to marry the man?


Anyway. How literally do you guys believe and obey the bible, and what does it mean to you? And what is the official Vizzed board consensus? 
I have not ever been a very religious guy, and since I started browsing the kind of pro atheist site called Reddit, my faith in a Christian God has dropped far below 50%. 

Since there are so many versions and translations of the Bible and the canon has been changed many times, I never believed that the Bible is directly made of Gods words unlike I know some do. Instead I believe that its written by pretty normal people and has their individual perspectives and ideas, and that the Bible is meant to lead people in the right direction, instead of giving answers to every question.  This has led me to take a very relativistic view of the bible.
Like I have always believed in evolution and such, so when I red the story of creation, I believed that the writer either meant that 1. Its just a one way to describe that God is omnipotent or 2. Its his personal theory of creation, and it became popular because back then people did know better. 
Also I think that the laws and rules written in the bible were more like guides and are subject to change over time, and thus should not be directly applied today. Like when Jesus says that we should sell everything that we have and give it to the poor, it should be red as "you should not try to achieve unnecessary riches, when you could use that wealth to help others." I still agree very much with this moral, like I do with pretty much everything Jesus said, especially what he said about forgiveness.

I know that there are thousands if not millions of fundamentalist Christians who claim to believe everything said in the Bible and obey all of its teachings still today. But I don't actually think that there is a single Christian who does all that. Like how many people you guys have heard tearing out their right eye because it did sin. Does anyone still believe that if a virgin girl gets raped, she should be forced to marry the man?


Anyway. How literally do you guys believe and obey the bible, and what does it mean to you? And what is the official Vizzed board consensus? 
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First of all, the Bible records (to my faith) history dating before any other book was written - perhaps I lack knowledge of this (and I'm not going to try to defend it), but is there any book predating the Bible?

We read history books about how George Washington was the 1st U.S. president, but did we see this for ourselves - no, we just read it and believe.

There were specific stuff which is written in the Old Testament which does not correlate to the New Testament (because of certain stuff which was unlawful for the Israelites at that time) while a lot of the stuff written in the Old Testament still applies for Christians.

In other words, a Christian will know what to take literally based on the teaching from the Holy Spirit himself, while someone who doesn't rely on his teaching will read it and think it's fake.

I can tell you personally that I am a changed person from what I used to be 8 years ago - all from surrendering my life to Christ and then starting to read the Bible.

So yeah, some stuff I don't read as literal because it was for the Israelites, but the majority (almost all of it) I read as literal.
First of all, the Bible records (to my faith) history dating before any other book was written - perhaps I lack knowledge of this (and I'm not going to try to defend it), but is there any book predating the Bible?

We read history books about how George Washington was the 1st U.S. president, but did we see this for ourselves - no, we just read it and believe.

There were specific stuff which is written in the Old Testament which does not correlate to the New Testament (because of certain stuff which was unlawful for the Israelites at that time) while a lot of the stuff written in the Old Testament still applies for Christians.

In other words, a Christian will know what to take literally based on the teaching from the Holy Spirit himself, while someone who doesn't rely on his teaching will read it and think it's fake.

I can tell you personally that I am a changed person from what I used to be 8 years ago - all from surrendering my life to Christ and then starting to read the Bible.

So yeah, some stuff I don't read as literal because it was for the Israelites, but the majority (almost all of it) I read as literal.
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tRUINE: What about writing on stones? Book of the dead or how about the dead sea scrolls or whatever else there is. Maybe the bible is the first mass distributed religious book but I doubt its the oldest or first book ever created.

Pretty much every religion has some sort of sky god and fairy tale behind it. When you cut all the fluff inserted by humans you will start to realize one thing in common, most if not all of these gods come from the heavens above. I think it should be obvious what is going on here.

We are dealing with multiple gods and or multiple origins, that explains the unique cultures all around the world. You got black people and white, you got chinese and indians.

How do 2 white people (adam and eve) create multiple cultures, with different races and languages? I think most people can relate to christianity most because the god looks like a human, if he looked like a serpent not many people would believe that here in America... He also looks white so that helps a bit to. God certainly is not human and if he looks like one its an illusion.

And most importantly, everything that is written in books or on stone are done most likely by humans. If god wrote it then what is the point of having all those people in there and then having them rewrite more then once.

I believe what I see in stone more then I do in text books. You can't really erase or rewrite what is on stone, you could but its going to be a lot harder in the process. I also take stone over paper any day of the week in terms of origins of a god. Paper is something humans like to manufacture so the dating on it is most likely after all the stone drawings. That should disprove the bible being first book ever made, cause there were books long before it and even before books existed people used stone to draw or write what they saw.

This is why I like the pyramids and ancient architecture. Instead of a book called a bible we actually have mummified bodies and amazing structures that come with drawings and unbelievable superior intelligence linking them to sky gods through their structures.

Something about stone drawings and amazing architectures seem more original and organic then what is written in a book which is why I'll never believe anything said nor written in the bible. Maybe some of the stuff in there is real, but its lacking the holy grain of evidence. It's depressing that people believe in it when virtually all the evidence is non-existant in my opinion. The bible to me is a watered down link to god or quite possibly an entire fabrication, no offense. If I am to believe in any god I'll need to see structures to show how serious they are (churches do not count, maybe originals but not duplicates) and astrological importance in the structures which link them to a god. A book is not good enough, its not evidence and its not convincing and I will leave it at that. I'm more visual that probably explains why I'm not a fan of books

You are better off believing original structures and physical evidence then you are to believe words in a book that have been respun countless amount of times. Nothing wrong with your religion, but I think people need to focus more on what is authentic then what is fabricated. The bible and churches both are fabricated and reproduced. The more its reproduced and the more bibles that are made the less it looks authentic. I think its stupid for me to go outside and replicate the pyramids and try to recreate a link to god. A link to god exist but it must be authentic in the exact location that the connection was made. Jesus and everything in the bible as far as I know have nothing to do with USA. USA imported the bible and look what we have a bunch of phonies and cons (not all) but there are a lot of fakers out there who have given christianity a horrible name.

Before anyone calls themselves a true christian, please visit the location where Jesus was and prove it. That is what I call authentic christian someone who will go out of there way to connect with him. The lazy thing to do is pray beside your bed or go to the nearest church because its the easy way to cheat a connection to god. Finding god is not easy nor is connecting with him, that is why I think for the most part a lot of christianity is just fabricated. A book and a local church to me is just cheesy. Nothing about it is an authentic connection to god. God is one of a kind right? Then treat him that way, he is not a prostitute who you can connect with at every hotel bed and street corner at least not in my definition.

Sorry if it sounds like I am bashing christianity but let me justify it. There are a lot of fake people with fake connections to god faking everything they say and do to look authentic. I'll admit right here and now, I never met any christian nor catholic who followed suit, they claim to but I know deep down their connection is fraudulent. I'm not even sure you can call anyone an authentic religious person unless either they are at the actual location praying or are themselves apart of history when god came down to communicate. Everyone and everything after that and those who try to recreate the magic... all fake in my opinion You can try but I just don't think anyone actually has authentic connections nor affiliations with god except those who you read about. That is my opinion, take it with a grain of salt like the bible and you will better yourself
tRUINE: What about writing on stones? Book of the dead or how about the dead sea scrolls or whatever else there is. Maybe the bible is the first mass distributed religious book but I doubt its the oldest or first book ever created.

Pretty much every religion has some sort of sky god and fairy tale behind it. When you cut all the fluff inserted by humans you will start to realize one thing in common, most if not all of these gods come from the heavens above. I think it should be obvious what is going on here.

We are dealing with multiple gods and or multiple origins, that explains the unique cultures all around the world. You got black people and white, you got chinese and indians.

How do 2 white people (adam and eve) create multiple cultures, with different races and languages? I think most people can relate to christianity most because the god looks like a human, if he looked like a serpent not many people would believe that here in America... He also looks white so that helps a bit to. God certainly is not human and if he looks like one its an illusion.

And most importantly, everything that is written in books or on stone are done most likely by humans. If god wrote it then what is the point of having all those people in there and then having them rewrite more then once.

I believe what I see in stone more then I do in text books. You can't really erase or rewrite what is on stone, you could but its going to be a lot harder in the process. I also take stone over paper any day of the week in terms of origins of a god. Paper is something humans like to manufacture so the dating on it is most likely after all the stone drawings. That should disprove the bible being first book ever made, cause there were books long before it and even before books existed people used stone to draw or write what they saw.

This is why I like the pyramids and ancient architecture. Instead of a book called a bible we actually have mummified bodies and amazing structures that come with drawings and unbelievable superior intelligence linking them to sky gods through their structures.

Something about stone drawings and amazing architectures seem more original and organic then what is written in a book which is why I'll never believe anything said nor written in the bible. Maybe some of the stuff in there is real, but its lacking the holy grain of evidence. It's depressing that people believe in it when virtually all the evidence is non-existant in my opinion. The bible to me is a watered down link to god or quite possibly an entire fabrication, no offense. If I am to believe in any god I'll need to see structures to show how serious they are (churches do not count, maybe originals but not duplicates) and astrological importance in the structures which link them to a god. A book is not good enough, its not evidence and its not convincing and I will leave it at that. I'm more visual that probably explains why I'm not a fan of books

You are better off believing original structures and physical evidence then you are to believe words in a book that have been respun countless amount of times. Nothing wrong with your religion, but I think people need to focus more on what is authentic then what is fabricated. The bible and churches both are fabricated and reproduced. The more its reproduced and the more bibles that are made the less it looks authentic. I think its stupid for me to go outside and replicate the pyramids and try to recreate a link to god. A link to god exist but it must be authentic in the exact location that the connection was made. Jesus and everything in the bible as far as I know have nothing to do with USA. USA imported the bible and look what we have a bunch of phonies and cons (not all) but there are a lot of fakers out there who have given christianity a horrible name.

Before anyone calls themselves a true christian, please visit the location where Jesus was and prove it. That is what I call authentic christian someone who will go out of there way to connect with him. The lazy thing to do is pray beside your bed or go to the nearest church because its the easy way to cheat a connection to god. Finding god is not easy nor is connecting with him, that is why I think for the most part a lot of christianity is just fabricated. A book and a local church to me is just cheesy. Nothing about it is an authentic connection to god. God is one of a kind right? Then treat him that way, he is not a prostitute who you can connect with at every hotel bed and street corner at least not in my definition.

Sorry if it sounds like I am bashing christianity but let me justify it. There are a lot of fake people with fake connections to god faking everything they say and do to look authentic. I'll admit right here and now, I never met any christian nor catholic who followed suit, they claim to but I know deep down their connection is fraudulent. I'm not even sure you can call anyone an authentic religious person unless either they are at the actual location praying or are themselves apart of history when god came down to communicate. Everyone and everything after that and those who try to recreate the magic... all fake in my opinion You can try but I just don't think anyone actually has authentic connections nor affiliations with god except those who you read about. That is my opinion, take it with a grain of salt like the bible and you will better yourself
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JigSaw : Your post does make a lot of sense but it saddens me at the same time. I know for a fact that I am a changed person - not because of feelings and butterflies in my stomach - I'm talking about a genuine transformation from a relationship with God my Father.
JigSaw : Your post does make a lot of sense but it saddens me at the same time. I know for a fact that I am a changed person - not because of feelings and butterflies in my stomach - I'm talking about a genuine transformation from a relationship with God my Father.
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Sea_Food :
Huh....didn't realize Reddit is a pro atheist site...I don't go on it but I've always thought it was just a bunch of people posting artistic and programming stuff on there.

Anyways, back on topic.

First of, your statement about the versions and translations and the canon. Different versions doesn't change a whole lot. It is only an updating of the Bible because our modern languages change very quickly. It is also based on the translation style. Some people want word-for-word, while some people want meaning-for-meaning. I've actually briefly explained this in a video that I made for a YouTube series (4:33 minutes) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QugZZYFpb5U. Translations doesn't change much either. Translations does not change the text itself, but a different language of the original text. Readers are also responsible in understanding the differences in meaning between ancient languages vs. modern languages. That is why we have concordances, Bible dictionaries, and study Bibles.

You are right that the writers of the Bible are normal people. That is what makes the Bible so special. These are different people from different backgrounds (kings, prophets, historians, disciples of Jesus), from different time periods, spreading from 3 different continents, all inspired by God to write different books of the Bible. Even with all these differences from the writer, the perspectives and ideas from these "individuals" flow with consistency throughout the book, with their "different" views from these different people to build each other and support each other. Notice that some verses in the Bible quote back or relate back to a previous book of the Bible, even though they are written in different times. It is from this that we can see how incredible such a book is formed together, and it makes it so wonderful that God made a way to communicate to us about Him and how to come back to Him from the separation of sin through the Bible. So when we say that the Bible is the authoritative Word of God, the Bible is God-breathed/God-inspired, meaning that God is the writer and the orchestrater, while Man is the instrument and the pen that write down the words.

"the Bible is meant to lead people in the right direction, instead of giving answers to every question. This has led me to take a very relativistic view of the bible."
This comment doesn't makes sense to me. You said that the Bible leads people to the right direction and yet you say you view the Bible in a relativistic way. How is that relativistic when you already made an absolute standard that the Bible is leading people to the right direction?

Like I have always believed in evolution and such, so when I red the story of creation, I believed that the writer either meant that 1. Its just a one way to describe that God is omnipotent or 2. Its his personal theory of creation, and it became popular because back then people did know better.
Yeah, there are different Christians who debate about that. It doesn't degrade the Bible though. You see that those who are Theistic Evolutionists and Old Earth/Young Earth Creationist still relate to the Bible on how the Bible is interpreted based on both Theology and Science. Remember that there are two things that reveals God's truth: Special Revelation (God's Word) and General Revelation (God's Creation). Both work together in revealing about God. The question comes down to how Man interpret SR and GR, and we strive to continue to study both to find out about God and his truth. So if evolution is true, it helps the Bible; if Creationism is true, it helps the Bible. The question comes down to how to interpret these two revelations to come down to truth and we have seen examples of flaws in human interpretations in theology and science. Either way, the Evolution/Creation debate is not a primary issue.

"Also I think that the laws and rules written in the bible were more like guides and are subject to change over time, and thus should not be directly applied today. "

"I know that there are thousands if not millions of fundamentalist Christians who claim to believe everything said in the Bible and obey all of its teachings still today. But I don't actually think that there is a single Christian who does all that. Like how many people you guys have heard tearing out their right eye because it did sin. Does anyone still believe that if a virgin girl gets raped, she should be forced to marry the man?"

This is where you need to understand that there are rules in interpreting the Bible. Reading the Bible is like reading every other work. You have to keep the context, background, time, date, culture in mind. Understand that there are certain things that Christians don't follow because of the New Covenant took over the Old Covenant. (If there is someone still following it, oh well). Because of the new covenant, there are some laws that don't apply now. However, God's Word still stays the same. Just because there are some cultural laws and sacrificial laws that changed due to a change in culture and covenant, there are principles in them that stays true even in the New Testament. Also, moral laws still remain the same, because God stays the same, which is why no Christian or Church Father would go against the Ten Commandments, for they are moral laws. You notice that this is why no one changed Leviticus. Even though those laws don't apply to Christians anymore, they are still reminding about how there is an Old Covenant and, by God's Grace, there is a New covenant now.

You need to look at the context to tell whether something should be interpreted literally, figuratively, allegorically, or a combination. This is important because it is extremely dangerous if one misinterprets one over the other (interpret something the author intended figuratively as literal, and vice versa)

But if you are asking for something specific, yes, I do believe in literal miracles and indirect miracles. Yes, I do believe that supernatural events in the Bible happened. Yes, I do believe that the Bible is the Authoritative Word of God. Yes, I do believe that the Bible shows the standard of what Godliness and goodness is.

"Like when Jesus says that we should sell everything that we have and give it to the poor, it should be red as "you should not try to achieve unnecessary riches, when you could use that wealth to help others." I still agree very much with this moral, like I do with pretty much everything Jesus said, especially what he said about forgiveness."
Did you check the context of that verse? Jesus said that to the rich young ruler, who was asking how one obtains eternal life. Jesus was pointing out something about him and convicting him about where his heart is: His heart is on his money and not God. If his love is not on money, he would have gladly not be rich and help the poor with how much he had. It was not the money that was the root of evil, but "the love of money is the root of all evil" (1 Tim. 6:10). So the way you read it is similar to how Jesus said it, only He said it to convict the rich young ruler's heart, which is why he was "disheartened by the saying, he went away sorrowful, for he had great possessions." (Mark 10:22)

Here is my question back to you. Have you read the Bible as a whole? Because from what you wrote, I saw a couple of misconceptions of the Bible already that I feel that is based on hearsay or unobserved opinion. Correct me if I am wrong.

JigSaw :
Few thoughts:
1. Interestingly, the Dead Sea Scrolls are one of the findings that supports the authenticity of scripture.

2. Who said Adam and Eve are white?

3."And most importantly, everything that is written in books or on stone are done most likely by humans. If god wrote it then what is the point of having all those people in there and then having them rewrite more then once. "
Read what I wrote above about that.

4. "I believe what I see in stone more then I do in text books. You can't really erase or rewrite what is on stone, you could but its going to be a lot harder in the process. I also take stone over paper any day of the week in terms of origins of a god. Paper is something humans like to manufacture so the dating on it is most likely after all the stone drawings. That should disprove the bible being first book ever made, cause there were books long before it and even before books existed people used stone to draw or write what they saw."
Yeah, I can agree with the statement that the whole Bible is not the first thing that formed. I don't agree with the idea that earlier means more truthful either. (I feel that that is a fallacy or something, like something done first does not mean that it is true or something, idk)

5.This is why I like the pyramids and ancient architecture. Instead of a book called a bible we actually have mummified bodies and amazing structures that come with drawings and unbelievable superior intelligence linking them to sky gods through their structures.
Both Solomon's Temple and Herod's Temple in Jerusalem? Walls of Jericho? Inscriptions of Sargon II? Some structures in Egypt also relate to the events of late Genesis and Exodus. There is no lack of them.

6.Something about stone drawings and amazing architectures seem more original and organic then what is written in a book which is why I'll never believe anything said nor written in the bible. Maybe some of the stuff in there is real, but its lacking the holy grain of evidence. It's depressing that people believe in it when virtually all the evidence is non-existant in my opinion. The bible to me is a watered down link to god or quite possibly an entire fabrication, no offense. If I am to believe in any god I'll need to see structures to show how serious they are (churches do not count, maybe originals but not duplicates) and astrological importance in the structures which link them to a god. A book is not good enough, its not evidence and its not convincing and I will leave it at that. I'm more visual that probably explains why I'm not a fan of books
Right, which is why there is evidence of it (history, archaeology, science, philosophy, logic, etc). All of these have been supporting Christianity with a plethora of evidence. But don't count the Bible out of those authenticities like architectures, drawings, etc. The Bible has the most manuscripts, the closest manuscripts to its original writing date, and the most consistent manuscripts compared to all of the other authentic works (like works of Plato, about Julius Caesar, Homer's poems) COMBINED.

7. You are better off believing original structures and physical evidence then you are to believe words in a book that have been respun countless amount of times. Nothing wrong with your religion, but I think people need to focus more on what is authentic then what is fabricated. The bible and churches both are fabricated and reproduced. The more its reproduced and the more bibles that are made the less it looks authentic. I think its stupid for me to go outside and replicate the pyramids and try to recreate a link to god. A link to god exist but it must be authentic in the exact location that the connection was made. Jesus and everything in the bible as far as I know have nothing to do with USA. USA imported the bible and look what we have a bunch of phonies and cons (not all) but there are a lot of fakers out there who have given christianity a horrible name.
Hey, we are in some sort of agreement. Christians hate fakers too. There is obviously so many who has the title "Christian" and yet don't live like they are changed by God through trusting in Jesus. The Bible (which you were harping against) actually speaks against them and even gave pointers on how we can see fakers: You will know them by their fruit, “For no good tree bears bad fruit, nor again does a bad tree bear good fruit," (Luke 6:43) So you and me both are frustrated about fakers, but in all honesty, some of them are not that hard to spot, and most important of all, they can't hide from God.

8.Before anyone calls themselves a true christian, please visit the location where Jesus was and prove it. That is what I call authentic christian someone who will go out of there way to connect with him. The lazy thing to do is pray beside your bed or go to the nearest church because its the easy way to cheat a connection to god. Finding god is not easy nor is connecting with him, that is why I think for the most part a lot of christianity is just fabricated. A book and a local church to me is just cheesy. Nothing about it is an authentic connection to god. God is one of a kind right? Then treat him that way, he is not a prostitute who you can connect with at every hotel bed and street corner at least not in my definition.
Interesting...I would actually think that you would say something different about those who claim to be authentic Christians, like "practice what you preach" or "living by what you believe". Either way, it's an unreasonable argument to say that Christians are not authentic if they have never been to Israel. Some people can't afford or are held back from being able to go to Israel. But that argument doesn't make sense anyways. I can't imagine anything else to have this type of reasoning. Just because a scientist could not go to CERN doesn't mean that he is not an authentic particle physicists; just because a Western philosopher didn't go to Greece doesn't mean that he is not an authentic Western philosopher. It is their research that displays their real authenticity, and it is by the Christian's fruit that shows that they are a follower of Christ.

9.With your rant at the end, it kinda makes me wonder: I know that this isn't much to go off with, but you have seen some of my posts, some of tRUINE's posts, some of other people on this forum who posts in support of Christianity. (Again, I know this isn't much to go off with) In your opinion, do you consider any of us to be authentic Christians?
Sea_Food :
Huh....didn't realize Reddit is a pro atheist site...I don't go on it but I've always thought it was just a bunch of people posting artistic and programming stuff on there.

Anyways, back on topic.

First of, your statement about the versions and translations and the canon. Different versions doesn't change a whole lot. It is only an updating of the Bible because our modern languages change very quickly. It is also based on the translation style. Some people want word-for-word, while some people want meaning-for-meaning. I've actually briefly explained this in a video that I made for a YouTube series (4:33 minutes) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QugZZYFpb5U. Translations doesn't change much either. Translations does not change the text itself, but a different language of the original text. Readers are also responsible in understanding the differences in meaning between ancient languages vs. modern languages. That is why we have concordances, Bible dictionaries, and study Bibles.

You are right that the writers of the Bible are normal people. That is what makes the Bible so special. These are different people from different backgrounds (kings, prophets, historians, disciples of Jesus), from different time periods, spreading from 3 different continents, all inspired by God to write different books of the Bible. Even with all these differences from the writer, the perspectives and ideas from these "individuals" flow with consistency throughout the book, with their "different" views from these different people to build each other and support each other. Notice that some verses in the Bible quote back or relate back to a previous book of the Bible, even though they are written in different times. It is from this that we can see how incredible such a book is formed together, and it makes it so wonderful that God made a way to communicate to us about Him and how to come back to Him from the separation of sin through the Bible. So when we say that the Bible is the authoritative Word of God, the Bible is God-breathed/God-inspired, meaning that God is the writer and the orchestrater, while Man is the instrument and the pen that write down the words.

"the Bible is meant to lead people in the right direction, instead of giving answers to every question. This has led me to take a very relativistic view of the bible."
This comment doesn't makes sense to me. You said that the Bible leads people to the right direction and yet you say you view the Bible in a relativistic way. How is that relativistic when you already made an absolute standard that the Bible is leading people to the right direction?

Like I have always believed in evolution and such, so when I red the story of creation, I believed that the writer either meant that 1. Its just a one way to describe that God is omnipotent or 2. Its his personal theory of creation, and it became popular because back then people did know better.
Yeah, there are different Christians who debate about that. It doesn't degrade the Bible though. You see that those who are Theistic Evolutionists and Old Earth/Young Earth Creationist still relate to the Bible on how the Bible is interpreted based on both Theology and Science. Remember that there are two things that reveals God's truth: Special Revelation (God's Word) and General Revelation (God's Creation). Both work together in revealing about God. The question comes down to how Man interpret SR and GR, and we strive to continue to study both to find out about God and his truth. So if evolution is true, it helps the Bible; if Creationism is true, it helps the Bible. The question comes down to how to interpret these two revelations to come down to truth and we have seen examples of flaws in human interpretations in theology and science. Either way, the Evolution/Creation debate is not a primary issue.

"Also I think that the laws and rules written in the bible were more like guides and are subject to change over time, and thus should not be directly applied today. "

"I know that there are thousands if not millions of fundamentalist Christians who claim to believe everything said in the Bible and obey all of its teachings still today. But I don't actually think that there is a single Christian who does all that. Like how many people you guys have heard tearing out their right eye because it did sin. Does anyone still believe that if a virgin girl gets raped, she should be forced to marry the man?"

This is where you need to understand that there are rules in interpreting the Bible. Reading the Bible is like reading every other work. You have to keep the context, background, time, date, culture in mind. Understand that there are certain things that Christians don't follow because of the New Covenant took over the Old Covenant. (If there is someone still following it, oh well). Because of the new covenant, there are some laws that don't apply now. However, God's Word still stays the same. Just because there are some cultural laws and sacrificial laws that changed due to a change in culture and covenant, there are principles in them that stays true even in the New Testament. Also, moral laws still remain the same, because God stays the same, which is why no Christian or Church Father would go against the Ten Commandments, for they are moral laws. You notice that this is why no one changed Leviticus. Even though those laws don't apply to Christians anymore, they are still reminding about how there is an Old Covenant and, by God's Grace, there is a New covenant now.

You need to look at the context to tell whether something should be interpreted literally, figuratively, allegorically, or a combination. This is important because it is extremely dangerous if one misinterprets one over the other (interpret something the author intended figuratively as literal, and vice versa)

But if you are asking for something specific, yes, I do believe in literal miracles and indirect miracles. Yes, I do believe that supernatural events in the Bible happened. Yes, I do believe that the Bible is the Authoritative Word of God. Yes, I do believe that the Bible shows the standard of what Godliness and goodness is.

"Like when Jesus says that we should sell everything that we have and give it to the poor, it should be red as "you should not try to achieve unnecessary riches, when you could use that wealth to help others." I still agree very much with this moral, like I do with pretty much everything Jesus said, especially what he said about forgiveness."
Did you check the context of that verse? Jesus said that to the rich young ruler, who was asking how one obtains eternal life. Jesus was pointing out something about him and convicting him about where his heart is: His heart is on his money and not God. If his love is not on money, he would have gladly not be rich and help the poor with how much he had. It was not the money that was the root of evil, but "the love of money is the root of all evil" (1 Tim. 6:10). So the way you read it is similar to how Jesus said it, only He said it to convict the rich young ruler's heart, which is why he was "disheartened by the saying, he went away sorrowful, for he had great possessions." (Mark 10:22)

Here is my question back to you. Have you read the Bible as a whole? Because from what you wrote, I saw a couple of misconceptions of the Bible already that I feel that is based on hearsay or unobserved opinion. Correct me if I am wrong.

JigSaw :
Few thoughts:
1. Interestingly, the Dead Sea Scrolls are one of the findings that supports the authenticity of scripture.

2. Who said Adam and Eve are white?

3."And most importantly, everything that is written in books or on stone are done most likely by humans. If god wrote it then what is the point of having all those people in there and then having them rewrite more then once. "
Read what I wrote above about that.

4. "I believe what I see in stone more then I do in text books. You can't really erase or rewrite what is on stone, you could but its going to be a lot harder in the process. I also take stone over paper any day of the week in terms of origins of a god. Paper is something humans like to manufacture so the dating on it is most likely after all the stone drawings. That should disprove the bible being first book ever made, cause there were books long before it and even before books existed people used stone to draw or write what they saw."
Yeah, I can agree with the statement that the whole Bible is not the first thing that formed. I don't agree with the idea that earlier means more truthful either. (I feel that that is a fallacy or something, like something done first does not mean that it is true or something, idk)

5.This is why I like the pyramids and ancient architecture. Instead of a book called a bible we actually have mummified bodies and amazing structures that come with drawings and unbelievable superior intelligence linking them to sky gods through their structures.
Both Solomon's Temple and Herod's Temple in Jerusalem? Walls of Jericho? Inscriptions of Sargon II? Some structures in Egypt also relate to the events of late Genesis and Exodus. There is no lack of them.

6.Something about stone drawings and amazing architectures seem more original and organic then what is written in a book which is why I'll never believe anything said nor written in the bible. Maybe some of the stuff in there is real, but its lacking the holy grain of evidence. It's depressing that people believe in it when virtually all the evidence is non-existant in my opinion. The bible to me is a watered down link to god or quite possibly an entire fabrication, no offense. If I am to believe in any god I'll need to see structures to show how serious they are (churches do not count, maybe originals but not duplicates) and astrological importance in the structures which link them to a god. A book is not good enough, its not evidence and its not convincing and I will leave it at that. I'm more visual that probably explains why I'm not a fan of books
Right, which is why there is evidence of it (history, archaeology, science, philosophy, logic, etc). All of these have been supporting Christianity with a plethora of evidence. But don't count the Bible out of those authenticities like architectures, drawings, etc. The Bible has the most manuscripts, the closest manuscripts to its original writing date, and the most consistent manuscripts compared to all of the other authentic works (like works of Plato, about Julius Caesar, Homer's poems) COMBINED.

7. You are better off believing original structures and physical evidence then you are to believe words in a book that have been respun countless amount of times. Nothing wrong with your religion, but I think people need to focus more on what is authentic then what is fabricated. The bible and churches both are fabricated and reproduced. The more its reproduced and the more bibles that are made the less it looks authentic. I think its stupid for me to go outside and replicate the pyramids and try to recreate a link to god. A link to god exist but it must be authentic in the exact location that the connection was made. Jesus and everything in the bible as far as I know have nothing to do with USA. USA imported the bible and look what we have a bunch of phonies and cons (not all) but there are a lot of fakers out there who have given christianity a horrible name.
Hey, we are in some sort of agreement. Christians hate fakers too. There is obviously so many who has the title "Christian" and yet don't live like they are changed by God through trusting in Jesus. The Bible (which you were harping against) actually speaks against them and even gave pointers on how we can see fakers: You will know them by their fruit, “For no good tree bears bad fruit, nor again does a bad tree bear good fruit," (Luke 6:43) So you and me both are frustrated about fakers, but in all honesty, some of them are not that hard to spot, and most important of all, they can't hide from God.

8.Before anyone calls themselves a true christian, please visit the location where Jesus was and prove it. That is what I call authentic christian someone who will go out of there way to connect with him. The lazy thing to do is pray beside your bed or go to the nearest church because its the easy way to cheat a connection to god. Finding god is not easy nor is connecting with him, that is why I think for the most part a lot of christianity is just fabricated. A book and a local church to me is just cheesy. Nothing about it is an authentic connection to god. God is one of a kind right? Then treat him that way, he is not a prostitute who you can connect with at every hotel bed and street corner at least not in my definition.
Interesting...I would actually think that you would say something different about those who claim to be authentic Christians, like "practice what you preach" or "living by what you believe". Either way, it's an unreasonable argument to say that Christians are not authentic if they have never been to Israel. Some people can't afford or are held back from being able to go to Israel. But that argument doesn't make sense anyways. I can't imagine anything else to have this type of reasoning. Just because a scientist could not go to CERN doesn't mean that he is not an authentic particle physicists; just because a Western philosopher didn't go to Greece doesn't mean that he is not an authentic Western philosopher. It is their research that displays their real authenticity, and it is by the Christian's fruit that shows that they are a follower of Christ.

9.With your rant at the end, it kinda makes me wonder: I know that this isn't much to go off with, but you have seen some of my posts, some of tRUINE's posts, some of other people on this forum who posts in support of Christianity. (Again, I know this isn't much to go off with) In your opinion, do you consider any of us to be authentic Christians?
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I won't say much, but I will say I believe strictly in the Word of God.  God's Word is true not matter the interpretation of a Bible.  Though I use KJV.
I won't say much, but I will say I believe strictly in the Word of God.  God's Word is true not matter the interpretation of a Bible.  Though I use KJV.
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mr.pace : Wise words actually - whether you make a long post or short post about this changes nothing about the Word.
mr.pace : Wise words actually - whether you make a long post or short post about this changes nothing about the Word.
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tRIUNE : True.   The literally Word of God is all that I need to be contempt.  No matter which book it's in.  I will Praise the Lord for his name sake.
tRIUNE : True.   The literally Word of God is all that I need to be contempt.  No matter which book it's in.  I will Praise the Lord for his name sake.
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I believe with my full heart and soul, that the Bible is completely infallible.

Now, that being said, I think anyone has to be very careful with such a statement.  The -true- Bible is God-inspired, and God promised us that He would keep His law pure.  In other words, throughout the millenniums, His Word would remain unchanged.  Why would God after all, give us Law only to allow it to change due to human error?  We could hardly be to blame if God said "Sure, there might be errors!  I didn't stop them!"  This would leave believers in a very difficult predicament.  What to believe and what not to believe?!  We already have a hard enough time with such questions!

Therefore, I believe that the bible is infallible, but I also believe it is important to know what the bible actually is, or rather, which version of the Bible is truly God's Law.  There are dozens of books out there which bare the title and are anything but biblical.

I'm a die-hard KJV fan.  No other version seems to maintain its accuracy and sincerity.  If you do some reading or research into the work that King James and his men did to ensure the Bible's authenticity....well the amount of effort they put into the translation leaves me comfortable with the version.  I've compared versions upon versions, and the changes made within some are absolutely stunning.  Many of the other versions contain contradictions, eliminate verses, or add to them.  The KJV never contradicts, despite what many people will say.  A careful examination reveals, in all cases, that people making such claims didn't have a full understanding of passages, took verses out of context, or simply didn't take a look at surrounding verses/chapters/books.

@Play4fun:  I -really- enjoyed reading your post!  Well formulated, well written, and insightful.  I didn't agree with -everything- you wrote, but for the most part, I concur!  Kudos!
I believe with my full heart and soul, that the Bible is completely infallible.

Now, that being said, I think anyone has to be very careful with such a statement.  The -true- Bible is God-inspired, and God promised us that He would keep His law pure.  In other words, throughout the millenniums, His Word would remain unchanged.  Why would God after all, give us Law only to allow it to change due to human error?  We could hardly be to blame if God said "Sure, there might be errors!  I didn't stop them!"  This would leave believers in a very difficult predicament.  What to believe and what not to believe?!  We already have a hard enough time with such questions!

Therefore, I believe that the bible is infallible, but I also believe it is important to know what the bible actually is, or rather, which version of the Bible is truly God's Law.  There are dozens of books out there which bare the title and are anything but biblical.

I'm a die-hard KJV fan.  No other version seems to maintain its accuracy and sincerity.  If you do some reading or research into the work that King James and his men did to ensure the Bible's authenticity....well the amount of effort they put into the translation leaves me comfortable with the version.  I've compared versions upon versions, and the changes made within some are absolutely stunning.  Many of the other versions contain contradictions, eliminate verses, or add to them.  The KJV never contradicts, despite what many people will say.  A careful examination reveals, in all cases, that people making such claims didn't have a full understanding of passages, took verses out of context, or simply didn't take a look at surrounding verses/chapters/books.

@Play4fun:  I -really- enjoyed reading your post!  Well formulated, well written, and insightful.  I didn't agree with -everything- you wrote, but for the most part, I concur!  Kudos!
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Singelli : I'm assuming the thing that you didn't agree with is the versions topic since you are a die hard KJV?
Singelli : I'm assuming the thing that you didn't agree with is the versions topic since you are a die hard KJV?
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Well, I do disagree with you on that, actually, but it wasn't what I was thinking about when I made my comment.  LOL  Actually, it's the part about evolution/creationism I don't completely agree with.  I don't think evolution could promote God's Law at all, and I find it just absurd and laughable.

For many reasons, I think it -is- an important issue.  The evolution/creation debate seems to be a pretty big factor in people's disbelief and lack of faith.  When I consider all that evolution implies or brings into question, I can understand that effect.  Evolution creates a pretty big scope of contradictions and degradation to what the Bible actually tells us what happens.  I think people are fooled by a lot of modern science.  I personally believe that science can be used to prove what is actually portrayed in the Bible.

Like I said, what you and I disagree on is very minor indeed, seemingly.  I simply think it is a primary issue while you do not.  

It's true that I might have also read something out of context in your post.  I'll go back and re-read just to make certain.

Edit after re-reading:  I think now that I did.  I do believe that everything works together for the good of God.  I assume now that you were saying whichever is true (evolution or creation) doesn't matter because of that fact, right?  That no matter which you choose to believe, you still must realize that everything works together to promote God?
Well, I do disagree with you on that, actually, but it wasn't what I was thinking about when I made my comment.  LOL  Actually, it's the part about evolution/creationism I don't completely agree with.  I don't think evolution could promote God's Law at all, and I find it just absurd and laughable.

For many reasons, I think it -is- an important issue.  The evolution/creation debate seems to be a pretty big factor in people's disbelief and lack of faith.  When I consider all that evolution implies or brings into question, I can understand that effect.  Evolution creates a pretty big scope of contradictions and degradation to what the Bible actually tells us what happens.  I think people are fooled by a lot of modern science.  I personally believe that science can be used to prove what is actually portrayed in the Bible.

Like I said, what you and I disagree on is very minor indeed, seemingly.  I simply think it is a primary issue while you do not.  

It's true that I might have also read something out of context in your post.  I'll go back and re-read just to make certain.

Edit after re-reading:  I think now that I did.  I do believe that everything works together for the good of God.  I assume now that you were saying whichever is true (evolution or creation) doesn't matter because of that fact, right?  That no matter which you choose to believe, you still must realize that everything works together to promote God?
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The Bible does not say to "tear out your eye" it says, It would be better go into Heaven with one eye than sin... I believe that the Bible is completely true, but that doesn't make you not sin.
The Bible does not say to "tear out your eye" it says, It would be better go into Heaven with one eye than sin... I believe that the Bible is completely true, but that doesn't make you not sin.
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I am a KJV completely person. I believe every word of it.
I am a KJV completely person. I believe every word of it.
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The Bible is 100% true. Not all of the old testament is relevant, such as clean/unclean food. I believe that on the cross, Jesus removed some restrictions, such as sacrificing animals or eating restrictions.
The Bible is 100% true. Not all of the old testament is relevant, such as clean/unclean food. I believe that on the cross, Jesus removed some restrictions, such as sacrificing animals or eating restrictions.
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Sea_Food : Well I will be honest I don’t really read the bible much but I do sporadically read exerts of the bible online. I don’t actually have a bible in my home so I try to read online whenever I can. I have been recently trying to get a better in touch with my spiritual side. I have been going through rough times over the last several years and have been trying to make changes in my life. I went through a rough period in my teen years and even though I am many years removed from that period of my life I still have a lot of guilt, shame, regret and worry about that period of my life. My family and I have also been going through several problems over the last several years which have made things extremely trying and frankly have made things appear hopeless at times.

I will admit that my faith has been tested several times over the course of my life and there have been times where I have been angry with God. I never doubted the existence of God and although there have been times where I have gotten angry with God I have tried to make peace with him, This year in particular has been rough. My dad lost his job last year and is still looking for work and because of his age and the economic situation where we live he has been stone walled everywhere he looks. This alone has been a major source of stress on all of us because of the financial strain but we have tried to pull together as best as we can.

As far as me I have been in a legal dispute related to my writing for a couple of years and that has been extremely stressful on me. My writing is basically all I have because I am limited in what I can do physically due to being disabled. The stress of the dispute and the sitting and waiting has taken a toll on me. I don’t sleep well due to all of the stress and that certainly doesn’t make things easier. Earlier this year I lost my dog after sixteen years. It’s been extremely difficult trying to cope with all of the above.

In the process I have been trying to make some changes to make my life better and that has not been an easy task. I am trying to go back and finish school somehow and have been trying to teach myself in that I am trying to relearn stuff that I haven’t used in years and learn things I was never even offered access to when I was in school originally.

Through it all these challenges I do pray daily and have even been observing daily mass via the internet. As I said I do sporadically read exerts of the bible online as well. I would consider myself a novice at best due to not being deeply religious growing up and being sporadic in my reading of the bible. I do however owe God for what he’s done for me.

Despite times when I have been angry for one reason or another and despite all of the challenges that my family and I have had to deal with, I have remained steadfast in my faith, even during the most trying times where I have been full of anger I have vented my frustration to God and ask for his mercy. God has had my back when I have needed him and whether it be helping me recover when I was sick years ago, making sure I have some form of medical coverage or, by giving me the gift of being able to write which is what gave me purpose and served to straighten me out years ago when I was a screwed up teenager. Although I have been through my share of hard times, I’ve never forgotten that and never take it for granted.

I do take the commandments very seriously and try my best to follow that. I will admit that I do have my flaws however. I am not by no means a perfect man and as I said I have many regrets that I still deal with. As far as the bible as I said I am a novice at best and really couldn’t give you any direct quotes but one thing I take very seriously is judge not lest ye be judged.

I never try to judge anyone regardless of what they may be going through or have done. My way of thinking is for me to possibly judge anyone after what I have been through in my life would be hypocritical because I wouldn’t want to be judged etc. So I try as best as I can to be as sympathetic as possible and offer advice using what I have been through in my own experiences to hopefully give a little perspective. If I have helped one person with any advice I may have given, that’s all I ever try to do.


In regard to the bible I noticed while browsing my new Roku player that it does have an app or channel that I can listen to an audio version of the bible. I have been thinking of buying that app as it will help me be more vigilant as I try and get in touch better with my spiritual side or at least until I can afford to buy a physical bible.

I have actually been using my Roku player to observe daily mass so it has already served a purpose beyond mere entertainment value for helping me get better in touch with my spiritual side beyond mere daily prayer and such.

I’m sorry if I didn’t really answer the question. Hopefully soon I’ll be able to give a more educated answer. I hope nevertheless that my thoughts have offered some insight at least.
Sea_Food : Well I will be honest I don’t really read the bible much but I do sporadically read exerts of the bible online. I don’t actually have a bible in my home so I try to read online whenever I can. I have been recently trying to get a better in touch with my spiritual side. I have been going through rough times over the last several years and have been trying to make changes in my life. I went through a rough period in my teen years and even though I am many years removed from that period of my life I still have a lot of guilt, shame, regret and worry about that period of my life. My family and I have also been going through several problems over the last several years which have made things extremely trying and frankly have made things appear hopeless at times.

I will admit that my faith has been tested several times over the course of my life and there have been times where I have been angry with God. I never doubted the existence of God and although there have been times where I have gotten angry with God I have tried to make peace with him, This year in particular has been rough. My dad lost his job last year and is still looking for work and because of his age and the economic situation where we live he has been stone walled everywhere he looks. This alone has been a major source of stress on all of us because of the financial strain but we have tried to pull together as best as we can.

As far as me I have been in a legal dispute related to my writing for a couple of years and that has been extremely stressful on me. My writing is basically all I have because I am limited in what I can do physically due to being disabled. The stress of the dispute and the sitting and waiting has taken a toll on me. I don’t sleep well due to all of the stress and that certainly doesn’t make things easier. Earlier this year I lost my dog after sixteen years. It’s been extremely difficult trying to cope with all of the above.

In the process I have been trying to make some changes to make my life better and that has not been an easy task. I am trying to go back and finish school somehow and have been trying to teach myself in that I am trying to relearn stuff that I haven’t used in years and learn things I was never even offered access to when I was in school originally.

Through it all these challenges I do pray daily and have even been observing daily mass via the internet. As I said I do sporadically read exerts of the bible online as well. I would consider myself a novice at best due to not being deeply religious growing up and being sporadic in my reading of the bible. I do however owe God for what he’s done for me.

Despite times when I have been angry for one reason or another and despite all of the challenges that my family and I have had to deal with, I have remained steadfast in my faith, even during the most trying times where I have been full of anger I have vented my frustration to God and ask for his mercy. God has had my back when I have needed him and whether it be helping me recover when I was sick years ago, making sure I have some form of medical coverage or, by giving me the gift of being able to write which is what gave me purpose and served to straighten me out years ago when I was a screwed up teenager. Although I have been through my share of hard times, I’ve never forgotten that and never take it for granted.

I do take the commandments very seriously and try my best to follow that. I will admit that I do have my flaws however. I am not by no means a perfect man and as I said I have many regrets that I still deal with. As far as the bible as I said I am a novice at best and really couldn’t give you any direct quotes but one thing I take very seriously is judge not lest ye be judged.

I never try to judge anyone regardless of what they may be going through or have done. My way of thinking is for me to possibly judge anyone after what I have been through in my life would be hypocritical because I wouldn’t want to be judged etc. So I try as best as I can to be as sympathetic as possible and offer advice using what I have been through in my own experiences to hopefully give a little perspective. If I have helped one person with any advice I may have given, that’s all I ever try to do.


In regard to the bible I noticed while browsing my new Roku player that it does have an app or channel that I can listen to an audio version of the bible. I have been thinking of buying that app as it will help me be more vigilant as I try and get in touch better with my spiritual side or at least until I can afford to buy a physical bible.

I have actually been using my Roku player to observe daily mass so it has already served a purpose beyond mere entertainment value for helping me get better in touch with my spiritual side beyond mere daily prayer and such.

I’m sorry if I didn’t really answer the question. Hopefully soon I’ll be able to give a more educated answer. I hope nevertheless that my thoughts have offered some insight at least.
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01-22-13 04:57 PM
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The bible was written by men during a long period of time. It was compiled together by select group of men according to the politics of that time when they did and they let lots of christian text out according to their own whim. Therefore it at times contradicts itself and contains lots of stuff, especially out context, that could be interpreted in any way you wish. I doubt there is a single christian in the world or there has ever been who has fully followed all its teachings.

But I have to say I dont belive into the atheist forum of Reddit anymore so for wisdom.

So to answer to the question: Not at all, except for the parts I love to pick out, like do unto others and so on. The ten commandments also make sense, except for the parts about livestock and servants since I never had neither, but I just try to ignore those.
The bible was written by men during a long period of time. It was compiled together by select group of men according to the politics of that time when they did and they let lots of christian text out according to their own whim. Therefore it at times contradicts itself and contains lots of stuff, especially out context, that could be interpreted in any way you wish. I doubt there is a single christian in the world or there has ever been who has fully followed all its teachings.

But I have to say I dont belive into the atheist forum of Reddit anymore so for wisdom.

So to answer to the question: Not at all, except for the parts I love to pick out, like do unto others and so on. The ten commandments also make sense, except for the parts about livestock and servants since I never had neither, but I just try to ignore those.
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01-23-13 09:50 AM
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When I was still new in my faith, I too every word that I read in the Bible as literally as possible. Back then I was also a KJV purist. I also took every word that was said by a "man of God" (read: preacher) as the truth. As I grew in my faith over the past years and have been challenged in my beliefs my views have changed.
 
I go to a Christian College, in fact Christian Ministry is my minor. I have been challenged and taught that just because someone says something about God or scripture I shouldn't always believe them. As I studied, more focused, in the Word I realized how much was said to a particular group of people and not to our generation. That doesn't mean it is not relevant, rather it needs to be studied and applied with the original thought behind it. In terms of the KJV... I use at least 3 versions of the bible when I study it now, mostly for accuracy and understanding. Those are the NCV, KJV, and the NASB, among others.

I firmly believe the bible is the word of God, but it must be applied and studied before it is tossed anywhere in conversation or the pulpit. That's where the Holy Spirit comes in.
When I was still new in my faith, I too every word that I read in the Bible as literally as possible. Back then I was also a KJV purist. I also took every word that was said by a "man of God" (read: preacher) as the truth. As I grew in my faith over the past years and have been challenged in my beliefs my views have changed.
 
I go to a Christian College, in fact Christian Ministry is my minor. I have been challenged and taught that just because someone says something about God or scripture I shouldn't always believe them. As I studied, more focused, in the Word I realized how much was said to a particular group of people and not to our generation. That doesn't mean it is not relevant, rather it needs to be studied and applied with the original thought behind it. In terms of the KJV... I use at least 3 versions of the bible when I study it now, mostly for accuracy and understanding. Those are the NCV, KJV, and the NASB, among others.

I firmly believe the bible is the word of God, but it must be applied and studied before it is tossed anywhere in conversation or the pulpit. That's where the Holy Spirit comes in.
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I believe that the Bible is 100% true. All of it's writings were directed straight from God, through the writers. But they aren't word for word from God, or else there wouldn't be differences in some gospel readings. Now, I couldn't find what Bible version that he's talking about, but I use the  Douay Rheims version.
I believe that the Bible is 100% true. All of it's writings were directed straight from God, through the writers. But they aren't word for word from God, or else there wouldn't be differences in some gospel readings. Now, I couldn't find what Bible version that he's talking about, but I use the  Douay Rheims version.
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I do not know. If I understand this question, I do not believe in all the miracles of the bible, but I do believe and practice a lot of the values mentioned in the Bible.
I do not know. If I understand this question, I do not believe in all the miracles of the bible, but I do believe and practice a lot of the values mentioned in the Bible.
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Why have I just heard about this thread? Wow. Just wow.
Why have I just heard about this thread? Wow. Just wow.
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