After Furret's dominant victory in the most recent Tour de Vizzed, I was wondering—is Furret now the Tour de Vizzed GOAT? He and SonicOlmstead are now tied for the most Rainbow Banner victories, and he has the record for most monthly Jersey victories, but he actually ranks 4th in total points, behind David, Sonic, and zanderlex.

In order to answer my question, I developed a new Tour de Vizzed stat that I am calling "Ultimate TdV Score."

Here is how it works:

Every TdV point = +1 to Ultimate TdV Score
Every Jersey = +10 to Ultimate TdV Score
Monthly Jersey victory = +250
White Banner victory = +200
Gray Banner victory = +200
Rainbow Banner victory = +1,000

The idea is that Ultimate TdV Score emphasizes winning, but it also takes into account consistency by including total points and daily jerseys. Winning is valued higher than consistency, however.

Monthly jerseys are valued higher than the White/Gray Banner because they have tougher competition, and are harder to win.

I spent a few hours calculating UTdV Score for a number of people, and I believe this is the full list of everyone that currently has an UTdV Score of 1,000 or higher:

1. Furret - 18,438
2. SonicOlmstead - 17,181
3. zanderlex - 15,142
4. Davideo7 - 8,953
5. tornadocam - 8,299
6. SacredShadow - 7,686
7. tgags123 - 7,570
8. Yuna1000 - 7,509
9. gamerforlifeforever - 7,095
10. EX Palen - 6,617
11. Mynamescox44 - 6,078
12. classgame - 5,886
13. Barathemos - 5,211
14. thing1 - 5,079
15. IgorBird122 - 4,868
16. supercool22 - 4,464
17. Singelli - 4,421
18. legacyme3 - 4,277
19. janus - 3,989
20. no 8120 - 3,908
21. becerra95 - 3,598
22. geeogree - 3,444
23. Pacman+Marionfan - 3,266
24. Zlinqx - 3,213
25. pacman1755 - 2,793
26. Ferdinand - 2,575
27. Dauntez - 2,574
28. EideticMemory - 2,526
29. vizwiz123 - 2,305
30. Lexatom - 2,164
31. septembern - 2,090
32. iN008 - 2,023
33. Eirinn - 1,970
34. Eniitan - 1,965
35. thudricdholee - 1,733
36. Jordanv78 - 1,282
37. pray75 - 1,195
38. daisukiusagi - 1,149
39. kramer4077 - 1,135
40. Lonalan - 1,036
41. Zircron Swift - 1,030
42. tRIUNE - 1,014

I'm happy with the outcome here; I think this stat does a good job of ranking overall Tour de Vizzed performance. According to UTdV Score, Furret is, indeed, the GOAT.

What do you guys think? I would love to hear if anyone has any thoughts/input/criticism on my methodology!

This is a really fun way to look at tdv stats to try and determine a GOAT and after the month Furret just had I can't really argue for myself I'm more concentrated in my performances but Furret is so consistent across the board where I can't think of any real argument for myself over him not that there's really a point.

That said I do think if we did this stat again in a few years it's probably likely I'll eventually overtake him as one of my goals on the site is to be the only user to be in the top 10 of every tdv this decade as despite what the hall of fame says if you go back and look at winter 2020 David wasn't top 10 so I am the only user so far to be top 10 every tdv since the 2020s started and I'd like to pay that off by continuing to compete a bit so if people in the future look at the hall of fame page they can just see I was here for all of them during this time period. That said David bringing back the 4 tdvs a year has definitely made it more challenging to want to do it every time but I'm committed to it.

What I do find interesting is the list past the top 4 I'm not sure if this is how I would rank everyone else for example I know SacredShadow doesn't have as many jerseys and such but I was shocked to see him ranked below tornadocam.

Also White and Gray are really hard cause now white isn't a hard thing to fight for because you just have to sign up and score a point most tdvs but I imagine it was harder back in the day when it was harder to score and the site was more active and I assume more new users were eligible. Gray why being introduced at a point where it's not hard to win is also interesting though cause after a year or 2 of it being around almost every active member could win it but then the longer you wait to go for it the more people take themselves out of contention for it.

P.S. Glad my wife made the cut.

This is a fun statistic. I'll probably lose this title to Sonic if he remains semi active, which he's said he will. For now though I'm putting TdV GOAT on my resume lol

One criticism/point I do think is important to mention is that TdV scores have become more and more inflated over the years due to the introduction of the 7 pointer mechanic as well as the overall decline in activity (and as a result the decline in competition). It was so competitive back in the day that people would win with scores below even 200 points. 7 pointers in Blue that I had this past competition wouldn't have even landed me in the top 5 most days of the old ones.

It's near impossible to fairly simulate this general site activity in a mathematical formula without going deep in the rabbit hole so this stat will always be more biased towards people competing in the past 10 years or so. Users like Singelli and legacyme3 who were top competitors back in the day realistically should be much much higher than they are right now if we're talking about GOAT contention.

Maybe some % based system of the results would work better in that regard, instead of their flat point total? Winner of a TdV = 100% (plus a flat score for winning), second place's score is decided by how close they got to the winner and so on. I.E. if someone wins with 150 points and second place has 100 points, they'd score 67%. If third place has 75 points, they'd score 50%. It would take longer to calculate but if you only count the top 10 of each TdV as an entry requirement it would be doable.

It's really too bad the TdV came after my big posting days. We used to do the VCS and I dominated that but I don't know how you would incorporate that into this.... wouldn't really work.

I do like it though. It does seem to fairly accurately represent who the best at the TdV is.

I'm honestly surprised that I was as high up as I was. I've only won one TdV and haven't competed in too many so to score that high was surprising.

​​Going to try and use my previously proposed percentage-point system in a small scale of the first competition. Some slight discrepancies might occur for people who won some extra jerseys in later competitions (I did count leggy’s and David’s for this example as their scores would have been ridiculously inflated otherwise)

Every %-point in relation to the winner = +5 to Ultimate TdV Score
Every Jersey = +10 to Ultimate TdV Score
Monthly Jersey victory = +250
White Banner victory = +200
Gray Banner victory = +200
Rainbow Banner victory = +1,000

UTdV Scores (Competition 1):

vizwiz123 - 500 (score was 245) + 310(J) + 750(M) + 1000(R) = 2560 UTdV points

legacyme3 - 382 (76.3% of winner) + 110(J) = 492 UTdV points

LazloFalconi - 357 (71.4% of winner) + 190(J) + 200(W) = 747 UTdV points

ZircronSwift - 271 (54.3% of winner) + 230(J) + 250(M) = 751 UTdV points

Someone70 - 263 (52.7% of winner) + 100(J) = 363 UTdV points

rcarter2 - 192 (38.3% of winner) + 50(J) = 242 UTdV points

ArgusSwift - 159 (31.8% of winner) + 80(J) = 239 UTdV points

Davideo7 - 120 (24% of winner) + 20(J) = 140 UTdV points

Hawaiianbabidoll - 82 (16.3% of winner) + 30(J) = 112 UTdV points

YourMajestyKen - 73 (14.7% of winner) + 20(J) = 93 UTdV points

--

I feel like this works better than the flat score one, or at least it's more fair when you weigh scores against site activity/competition. A TdV winner's winning score is reflective of the competition, so having them be equal and trickling the remaining top 10 based on how close they got to that season's winner makes more sense to me. It also removes the 7 pointer issue entirely.

Dominant winners still get an edge over the others with things like jersey and monthly jersey wins.

You are absolutely correct about more recent competitions having inflated point totals due to 7-pointers and less competition. This is one of the reasons that I used flat numbers for the banners and Jerseys, and why I gave more weight to them than to total points. I do like your proposed solution, though. It would definitely take much longer to calculate, but it's a very good idea. If I can find some time, I might try to do a full calculation using your method. I'm curious what the end result would be.
Furret :

Luckily I'm such a stats nerd that I've been working on it since making that post lol, I'm up to 2014 right now, might take a day or two. It's not as bad as I thought. Once I have the winner's points written down I can just change one number in my formula every time to find the %-based points each person should get. I'm adding everyone's total daily jerseys at the end, that way I don't need to count them individually per competition. This is honestly what iPad kids must feel like except I'm calculating Tour de Vizzed stats instead

For what it's worth I really like the other 95% of your formula and methodology, just a minor nitpick as a math major lol

tgags123 :

I'm a stats nerd too, specifically when it comes to baseball. Your change actually reminds me a lot of OPS+ and ERA+ in baseball. I'd assume as a European that you're not too familiar with baseball stats, but basically, the idea is that the the average offense has changed substantially over time. For example, pitchers dominated in the 1960s and offense was scarce, whereas in the late 1990s and early 2000s, when everyone was on steroids, offense was super high. OPS+ and ERA+ compare a player's performance to the league-average in the seasons that they played, so that we can more accurately compare players from different eras.

So you're basically turning UTdV Score into UTdV+ by comparing to others in the same "season" and therefore adjusting for "era" lol.
Furret :

I found the following using % based scores and a flat boost for jerseys/banners. It's similar to your findings of course but if you look closely you can see that the gap between new and old is smaller, and you can even see a few shifts. Only scores of 1000+ are shown. There is still a slight bias towards newer competitors as the daily jersey count is directly related to site activity as well, but there's no way to properly simulate that

Every %-point in relation to the winner's score = +5 to Ultimate TdV Score (Example: the winner has 300 points. 75 points in that TdV would get you 25%, so an Ultimate TdV Score of 125. The winner's score is always worth 100%)

Every Jersey = +10 to Ultimate TdV Score
Monthly Jersey victory = +250
White Banner victory = +200
Gray Banner victory = +200
Rainbow Banner victory = +1,000


1) Furret - 17.747 (4x W)
2) SonicOlmstead - 16.602 (4x W)
3) zanderlex - 15.630 (3x W)
4) Davideo7 - 10.323 (1x W)
5) SacredShadow - 8189 (3x W)
6) Yuna1000 - 8180 (1x W)
7) tornadocam - 8036 (2x W)
8) gamerforlifeforever - 7738 (1x W)
9) tgags123 - 7622 (2x W)
10) Mynamescox44 - 6328 (2x W)
11) EX Palen - 6281 (1x W)
12) thing1 - 6028 (1x W)
13) Barathemos - 5802 (1x W)
14) classgame - 5703 (0x W)
15) IgorBird122 - 5486 (2x W)
16) Singelli - 5292 (1x W)
17) legacyme3 - 4804 (1x W)
18) janus - 4464 (1x W)
19) no 8120 - 4041 (0x W)
20) supercool22 - 3465 (1x W)
21) pacman1755 - 3296 (1x W)
22) becerra95 - 3265 (1x W)
23) Pacman+Mariofan - 3249 (1x W)
24) geeogree - 3139 (1x W)
25) Ferdinand - 3042 (0x W)
26) Zlinqx - 3017 (1x W)
27) iN008 - 2693 (1x W)
28) EideticMemory - 2600 (1x W)
29) vizwiz123 - 2560 (1x W)
30) Lexatom - 2396 (1x W)
31) septembern - 2310 (1x W)
32) Dauntez - 2282 (0x W)
33) thudricdholee - 2060 (1x W)
34) Eniitan - 1906 (0x W)
35) Eirinn - 1815 (0x W)
36) Jordanv78 - 1394 (0x W)
37) pray75 - 1375 (0x W)
38) kramer4077 - 1275 (0x W)
39) ZircronSwift - 1200 (0x W)
40) Lonalan - 1024 (0x W)
and barely scraping into this list
41) daisukiusagi - 1001 (0x W)

I'm going to work on a new stat next, which is average UTdV Score per top 10 appearance (2+ appearances as entry requirement). The difference should show who relies more on consistent, smaller scores for their ranking and who performs big every time they compete but competes less often, hindering their total score

Your version places me two spots lower, so obviously it's nonsense and my original version is superior.

I really appreciate you putting in the work to calculate this. I find it extremely interesting. Looking forward to seeing your findings with average UTdV Score per top 10 appearance!

Furret :

Why debating who’s the GOAT when you know it’s me. I’m the only winner who used just a cellular device to win this competition. No one can ever replicate my prestigious win and eloquent performance with the posts and determination

so basically these stats are invalid when referring who’s the GOAT when I’m here

Got my findings for average Ultimate Tour de Vizzed Score per top 10 appearance. I used my %-based findings for less recency bias. Entry barrier was 1000 total UTdV points and 2+ top-10 appearances.


Formula is simple:
total UTdV score / total top-10 appearances

The higher someone ends up, the harder they've competed on average. The lower someone ends up, the more they rely on consistent lower scores. I put the difference of their average ranking compared to their ranking in total score count, which is pretty telling for some.

A tiebreak goes to the person with the highest individual score.

Without further ado, these are the Average Ultimate Tour de Vizzed Scores:

[=] 1. Furret = 1775 (10 Appearances, 4 Wins)
[+13] 2. IgorBird122 = 1372 (4 Appearances, 2 Wins)
[+24] 3. iN008 = 1347 (2 Appearances, 1 Win)
[+6] 4. Mynamescox44 = 1266 (5 Appearances, 2 Wins)
[-3] 5. SonicOlmstead = 1107 (15 Appearances, 4 Wins)
[+20] 6. Zlinqx = 1006 (3 Appearances, 1 Win)

[+2] 7. tgags123 = 953 (8 Appearances, 2 Wins)
[-3] 8. SacredShadow = 910 (9 Appearances, 3 Wins)
[-2] 9. tornadocam = 893 (9 Appearances, 2 Wins)
[+11] 10. pacman1755 = 824 (4 Appearances, 1 Win)
[+14] 11. Ferdinand = 761 (4 Appearances, 0 Wins)
[+4] 12. Singelli = 756 (7 Appearances, 1 Win)

[+7] 13. supercool22 = 693 (5 Appearances, 1 Win)
[+8] 14. becerra95 = 653 (5 Appearances, 1 Win)
[-12] 15. zanderlex = 651 (24 Appearances, 3 Wins)
[+2] 16. janus = 638 (7 Appearances, 1 Win)
[+16] 17. kramer4077 = 638 (2 Appearances, 0 Wins)
[+12] 18. Eniitan = 635 (3 Appearances, 0 Wins)
[-5] 19. classgame = 634 (9 Appearances, 0 Wins)
[-3] 20. legacyme3 = 601 (8 Appearances, 1 Win)
[+13] 21. ZircronSwift = 600 (2 Appearances, 0 Wins)
[+6] 22. Lexatom = 599 (4 Appearances, 1 Win)
[=] 23. Pacman+Mariofan = 542 (6 Appearances, 1 Win)
[+11] 24. Lonalan = 512 (2 Appearances, 0 Wins)

[-17] 25. gamerforlifeforever = 484 (16 Appearances, 1 Win)
[-20] 26. Yuna1000 = 481 (17 Appearances, 1 Win)
[-3] 27. geeogree = 448 (7 Appearances, 1 Win)
[-15] 28. Barathemos = 446 (13 Appearances, 1 Win)
[-17] 29. thing1 = 402 (15 Appearances, 1 Win)
[+1] 30. Eirinn = 363 (5 Appearances, 0 Wins)
[+1] 31. Jordanv78 = 349 (4 Appearances, 0 Wins)
[+4] 32. daisukiusagi = 334 (3 Appearances, 0 Wins)
[-14] 33. no 8120 = 311 (13 Appearances, 0 Wins)
[-23] 34. EX Palen = 299 (21 Appearances, 1 Win)
[-6] 35. Dauntez = 285 (8 Appearances, 0 Wins)
[-32] 36. Davideo7 = 252 (41 Appearances, 1 Win)

---

I'll be honest, I think this is probably the most accurate ranking I can think of to determine the TdV GOAT, which was the original purpose of this whole UTdV statistic. I think you can clearly tell the top competitors of all time are right near the top, while consistent faces rank a bit lower.

You could probably make the barrier to entry stricter (say, 4+ entries AKA a full year's worth of TdV) to prevent potential 'Outliers'. A big example of this is iN008 catapulting into third place, kind of hard not to when you have a big win and only one other placement. All you'd have to do is remove the people with just 2 or 3 appearances, but the general order of the rest won't change at all.

I think there are some conclusions we can draw though:

- The first is that David is the obvious pick for biggest TdV fraud, plummeting from 4th highest total UTdV score all the way to 36th (dead last) in average UTdV score. This is a surprise to nobody, as he has by far the most top 10 appearances with 41 out of 43 competitions and only one win to his name.

- Other TdV consistency-over-dominance fraudsters include EX Palen, no 8120, Yuna1000, gamerforlifeforever, Barathemos, thing1, and most notably zanderlex (falling from third to out the top 10 entirely despite having 3 wins). All great A or even S tier competitors, but out the running for the GOAT conversation.

- If we are including everyone, the biggest dark horses for TdV GOAT title are iN008 and Zlinqx, each scoring over 1000 on average. Asterisk should be applied to due to their potential (and very probable) outlier status with 2 and 3 appearances respectively. There's a world where they come back one more time just to prove their spot isn't a fluke.

- If we remove the risk of outliers all together, the biggest dark horse for the TdV GOAT discussion is easily IgorBird122, jumping 13 spots all the way into second place with an average score of 1372 over 4 appearances. When half your appearances are wins, I think that deserves you a spot near the top of the table.

- The clear recipient of the 'Best to never win' category is Ferdinand, scoring an average of 761 over 4 appearances! This puts him in 11th place overall. Almost sneaking into the top 10 without a single win is incredible. He's come extremely close to winning once or twice. If that's not crazy enough, looking through the TdV competitions he participated in, he basically scored this high by competing in just two jerseys (the CP ones, Red and Green). Imagine if Ferdinand liked to ramble on forums as well, he'd probably be the front runner.

- Only one tie happened: janus and kramer4077 both ended up with an average UTdV score of 638. janus wins the tiebreaker on virtue of being the only one of the two to be a TdV Champion.

- Fun stats: the most dominant once-and-done performance comes from EideticMemory. He scored 2600 UTdV points on his first appearance when he won in 2014, and then never appeared since.

Fun stats: the most dominant one-time performance without a win goes to pray75, scoring 1375 UTdV points when he finished as the runner-up to iN008 back in 2013, never having appeared since. In fact, pray75's second place score is the highest of any runner-up ever, including those by people who have been regulars of the competition. You could probably call it the greatest runner-up performance of all time for a few reasons, except maybe on the metric of how close they got in points.

And the final, most important observation:

- Furret is by all metrics except nostalgia the TdV GOAT. He has a monstrous average UTdV score of 1775 over 10 appearances, with 4 of those being wins. Basically scoring 400 higher on average than second place (IgorBird122 with 1372). When you compare that to the people directly below him only having somewhere between 2 and 5 appearances each, that should put this topic to bed I think.

(I typed this purely as a sports commentator, I don't like to brag lol)

Thanks for putting this together! Super interesting information. I'm surprised to see Ferdinand rank that high.

I don't think average UTdV Score alone is the best metric for determining the TdV GOAT, however, as it heavily favors people with fewer top-10 finishes. The best way to maximize average UTdV Score is to have 2 or 3 strong TdVs and then never log in again.

SonicOlmstead, for example, is punished by still being active in competitions that he wasn't necessarily trying to win. If Sonic had completely disappeared off the face of the Earth after Summer 2022, he would definitely be top 2, and maybe even number 1. I don't think it should be considered a knock against him that he finished in the top 8 every TdV from Winter 2023 to Summer 2025 without actually competing in most of them. If anything, I think that should work slightly in his favor. Why would it be better for him to finish outside the top 10, rather than inside the top 10?

I think this is a great stat for measuring compete level, but I don't think it's as effective as measuring overall performance. The value of consistency vs. dominance can be debated, but I definitely don't think consistency should hurt someone's case.
Furret :

.

tgags123 : that's valid, and I honestly mostly agree with your argument. That's why I suggested increasing the barrier to entry for the GOAT discussion, to kind of do away with the 2 or 3 time appearances. Could even just count the 5 highest scores someone has gotten and go from there, ignoring times where they scored 8th or something by turning up for a few days max. I wish there was an easy way to sort of merge the two and get a result from that.

Ultimately it's all subjective anyway, someone who heavily values consistency over potential or the other way around will have a completely different list in mind. For some it's as simple as the most wins even, without any other considerations. I personally really value potential when it comes to the 'greatest XYZ', for example, so I disagree that just overall performance is the better metric as it doesn't really tell the full story of how good someone is. I could use Bobby Fischer in chessas an example of potential and why he's right up there for me for the GOAT discussion, even though he wasn't at the top for as long as say a Kasparov, which hurts some 'total stats' of his in comparison

We have enough down time before the next one to come up with something nearly perfect lol

Taking feedback into account, I looked at increasing the requirements needed to be considered for 'GOAT' status.

I'm only including people with the following:

- Five or more top-10 appearances, to prevent outliers only competing a few times and being rewarded for it and to highlight consistency more.

- Tour de Vizzed Champion, can't be considered the GOAT without winning the whole thing.


Now it's true that someone shouldn't get punished for scoring consistently across Tour de Vizzeds, which they would with the average score system. However I also don't think scoring say 120 points in a bunch of Tour de Vizzeds (about 4 a day on average) should really add much of anything to someone's GOAT status.

I tried to combine both these perspectives (valuing dominance & valuing consistency).

In order to highlight dominance, I added up every single eligible competitor's 5 highest UTdV scores. Only counting the 5 seasons when they went the hardest, AKA their max potential.

In order to highlight consistency, I then added their total jersey score across all competitions.

GOAT score = Score 1 + Score 2 + Score 3 + Score 4 + Score 5 + (10 x Jersey count)

(With Score 1, Score 2, ... being the 5 highest individual UTdV scores of that competitor)

That finally gave me the following ranking:

1) Furret - 15.439
2) SonicOlmstead - 14.169
3) zanderlex - 12.116
4) SacredShadow - 8157
5) tornadocam - 7988
6) tgags123 - 7691
7) Yuna1000 - 6797
8) Mynamescox44 - 6478
9) gamerforlifeforever - 6465
10) Davideo7 - 6223
11) EX Palen - 5589
12) Barathemos - 5481
13) thing1 - 5286
14) Singelli - 5163
15) legacyme3 - 4753
16) janus - 4563
17) supercool22 - 3615
18) becerra95 - 3415
19) Pacman+Mariofan - 3374
20) geeogree - 3271

I like the look of it. It roughly scales with total win count which I think makes sense for a GOAT list. Meanwhile people racking up a bunch of mid-table results in TdV don't get a big artificial boost as only the top 5 showings are counted. Consistency isn't hindering you but is also not hard carrying you.

I'm going to see if there's ways to improve this methodology further. I'm having fun trying different things and finding something that feels better every time. Love criticism as I'm only one person with one perspective, I think you need multiple people to come up with the best approach.

I think that it bumped David down makes sense. He consistently got points but was never trying to win or really compete. The fact that he was so highly rated before didn't make too much sense.

I like that I moved up to 20 from the original list.